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Joint Oireachtas Committee on Justice, Defence and Equality: General Scheme of the Garda Síochána (Recording Devices) (Amendment) Bill: Discussion (13 Feb 2024)

James Lawless: I remind members and witnesses to please switch their mobile phones to silent or flight mode. The purpose of today's meeting is to consider the general scheme of the Garda Síochána (recording devices) (amendment) Bill. We will have engagement with several stakeholders as part of our scrutiny of the general scheme. The scrutiny has been expedited as the matter was referred to...

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Justice, Defence and Equality: General Scheme of the Garda Síochána (Recording Devices) (Amendment) Bill: Discussion (13 Feb 2024)

James Lawless: I call Mr. McGarr solicitor with Digital Rights Ireland. He is also speaking on behalf of the ICCL in his opening remarks. Is that right?

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Justice, Defence and Equality: General Scheme of the Garda Síochána (Recording Devices) (Amendment) Bill: Discussion (13 Feb 2024)

James Lawless: I thank all of the witnesses for their opening remarks. I invite members to put their questions and have their engagement. As I said, there are six and a half minutes per member and interactions will flow within that. I call Senator Ruane.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Justice, Defence and Equality: General Scheme of the Garda Síochána (Recording Devices) (Amendment) Bill: Discussion (13 Feb 2024)

James Lawless: The witnesses can express a view but decisions will be exclusively made by the committee and the Oireachtas.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Justice, Defence and Equality: General Scheme of the Garda Síochána (Recording Devices) (Amendment) Bill: Discussion (13 Feb 2024)

James Lawless: We will allow the witnesses to answer. I will allow a little latitude on time as I know the Senator is racing against the clock, but she does not need to.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Justice, Defence and Equality: General Scheme of the Garda Síochána (Recording Devices) (Amendment) Bill: Discussion (13 Feb 2024)

James Lawless: Let us get the witnesses to explain that.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Justice, Defence and Equality: General Scheme of the Garda Síochána (Recording Devices) (Amendment) Bill: Discussion (13 Feb 2024)

James Lawless: Please let the witness answer the question, Senator.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Justice, Defence and Equality: General Scheme of the Garda Síochána (Recording Devices) (Amendment) Bill: Discussion (13 Feb 2024)

James Lawless: I thank the Commissioner and the Senator. I gave a little bit of latitude there because there was a robust engagement and it was helpful to set the scene, which may inform questions and comments from other members. I will move on now because I want to be fair and make sure everybody gets a chance to ask questions. Deputy Ó Ríordáin is next.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Justice, Defence and Equality: General Scheme of the Garda Síochána (Recording Devices) (Amendment) Bill: Discussion (13 Feb 2024)

James Lawless: We can take another answer. The Deputy had directed a question to someone else.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Justice, Defence and Equality: General Scheme of the Garda Síochána (Recording Devices) (Amendment) Bill: Discussion (13 Feb 2024)

James Lawless: We will take brief responses. I want to get around the table and get everyone in.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Justice, Defence and Equality: General Scheme of the Garda Síochána (Recording Devices) (Amendment) Bill: Discussion (13 Feb 2024)

James Lawless: Before we move on, I wish to drill into that answer because it is pertinent to the entire discussion. Mr. O'Sullivan said that in the use of this technology, the Garda is not attempting to make identifications. #the gist of what he said was that the intention is to reduce information to a smaller subset. I do not quite get that. Is the purpose not to retrospectively scan a crowd scene, as...

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Justice, Defence and Equality: General Scheme of the Garda Síochána (Recording Devices) (Amendment) Bill: Discussion (13 Feb 2024)

James Lawless: In the Foot Locker example, as opposed to scanning a crowd scene, retrospectively or otherwise, if an individual is suspected of perpetrating a crime in the footage, the Garda would almost tag the individual and look to see where he or she appears in other frames or in other video footage. Is that correct? It is a matter of tracing the movements of a particular individual through a set of...

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Justice, Defence and Equality: General Scheme of the Garda Síochána (Recording Devices) (Amendment) Bill: Discussion (13 Feb 2024)

James Lawless: That is very helpful. I thank Mr. Harris.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Justice, Defence and Equality: General Scheme of the Garda Síochána (Recording Devices) (Amendment) Bill: Discussion (13 Feb 2024)

James Lawless: I ask the witnesses to be relatively brief because I want to move on to the next member. I will allow the question to be answered as it is important.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Justice, Defence and Equality: General Scheme of the Garda Síochána (Recording Devices) (Amendment) Bill: Discussion (13 Feb 2024)

James Lawless: Who was the Deputy directing the question to?

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Justice, Defence and Equality: General Scheme of the Garda Síochána (Recording Devices) (Amendment) Bill: Discussion (13 Feb 2024)

James Lawless: I will indicate the next three members who are due to speak so they can prepare. Deputy Costello will be followed by Deputy Daly and Senator Gallagher.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Justice, Defence and Equality: General Scheme of the Garda Síochána (Recording Devices) (Amendment) Bill: Discussion (13 Feb 2024)

James Lawless: I am sorry, but will the Deputy or Ms Cronin define NCMEC?

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Justice, Defence and Equality: General Scheme of the Garda Síochána (Recording Devices) (Amendment) Bill: Discussion (13 Feb 2024)

James Lawless: I just wanted the gist of it so everyone is on the same page.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Justice, Defence and Equality: General Scheme of the Garda Síochána (Recording Devices) (Amendment) Bill: Discussion (13 Feb 2024)

James Lawless: I thank the Deputy.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Justice, Defence and Equality: General Scheme of the Garda Síochána (Recording Devices) (Amendment) Bill: Discussion (13 Feb 2024)

James Lawless: Deputy Costello's time has concluded.

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