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Joint Committee on Tourism, Culture, Arts, Sport And Media: Oversight of RTÉ's Expenditure of Public Funds and Governance Issues and Plans for Longer-term Support and Funding for Public Service Media: Minister for Tourism, Culture, Arts, Gaeltacht, Sport and Media (27 Feb 2024)

Catherine Martin: That is why I have said, going forward, that it needs to be given serious consideration as one of the reforms we need to see.

Joint Committee on Tourism, Culture, Arts, Sport And Media: Oversight of RTÉ's Expenditure of Public Funds and Governance Issues and Plans for Longer-term Support and Funding for Public Service Media: Minister for Tourism, Culture, Arts, Gaeltacht, Sport and Media (27 Feb 2024)

Catherine Martin: Again, the former director general is answerable for that decision.

Joint Committee on Tourism, Culture, Arts, Sport And Media: Oversight of RTÉ's Expenditure of Public Funds and Governance Issues and Plans for Longer-term Support and Funding for Public Service Media: Minister for Tourism, Culture, Arts, Gaeltacht, Sport and Media (27 Feb 2024)

Catherine Martin: I will get that information to you.

Joint Committee on Tourism, Culture, Arts, Sport And Media: Oversight of RTÉ's Expenditure of Public Funds and Governance Issues and Plans for Longer-term Support and Funding for Public Service Media: Minister for Tourism, Culture, Arts, Gaeltacht, Sport and Media (27 Feb 2024)

Catherine Martin: The terms of reference were never sent in the way they should have been sent, which would be a direct email to me clearly stating these were the new terms of reference, as was sent to me on 5 September-----

Joint Committee on Tourism, Culture, Arts, Sport And Media: Oversight of RTÉ's Expenditure of Public Funds and Governance Issues and Plans for Longer-term Support and Funding for Public Service Media: Minister for Tourism, Culture, Arts, Gaeltacht, Sport and Media (27 Feb 2024)

Catherine Martin: It was received along with 19 other documents.

Joint Committee on Tourism, Culture, Arts, Sport And Media: Oversight of RTÉ's Expenditure of Public Funds and Governance Issues and Plans for Longer-term Support and Funding for Public Service Media: Minister for Tourism, Culture, Arts, Gaeltacht, Sport and Media (27 Feb 2024)

Catherine Martin: I received them two months after the agreement with Richard Collins. That is exactly why we were querying it last week.

Joint Committee on Tourism, Culture, Arts, Sport And Media: Oversight of RTÉ's Expenditure of Public Funds and Governance Issues and Plans for Longer-term Support and Funding for Public Service Media: Minister for Tourism, Culture, Arts, Gaeltacht, Sport and Media (27 Feb 2024)

Catherine Martin: It was not even clear in how they were sent, and the cover letter - I had it earlier - did not refer to the terms of reference being in those 19 documents. That is another weakness in how communication was done.

Joint Committee on Tourism, Culture, Arts, Sport And Media: Oversight of RTÉ's Expenditure of Public Funds and Governance Issues and Plans for Longer-term Support and Funding for Public Service Media: Minister for Tourism, Culture, Arts, Gaeltacht, Sport and Media (27 Feb 2024)

Catherine Martin: It was in an RTÉ code of practices checklist. The email referred to a new folder being shared containing a sheet responding to the questions, and 19 further attachments cross-referenced in the document, with apologies for the delay. However, there was nothing with regard to flagging that these were the new terms of reference that have now come into effect, or when they came into...

Joint Committee on Tourism, Culture, Arts, Sport And Media: Oversight of RTÉ's Expenditure of Public Funds and Governance Issues and Plans for Longer-term Support and Funding for Public Service Media: Minister for Tourism, Culture, Arts, Gaeltacht, Sport and Media (27 Feb 2024)

Catherine Martin: The point is that they were never communicated properly to me. That is why I asked these questions last week. They sent it two months after, in a document-type dump regarding a code of practice checklist that we were seeking. That is a problem if new reforms are not communicated formally to the Minister. What was done on 5 September was the correct way of doing things regarding the...

Joint Committee on Tourism, Culture, Arts, Sport And Media: Oversight of RTÉ's Expenditure of Public Funds and Governance Issues and Plans for Longer-term Support and Funding for Public Service Media: Minister for Tourism, Culture, Arts, Gaeltacht, Sport and Media (27 Feb 2024)

Catherine Martin: I saw the reports saying that it was explicitly told to the officials, and then read that it was in a PAC meeting of many hours. Indeed, the Deputy who asked the question did see any significance to it. It was not reported on at the time.

Joint Committee on Tourism, Culture, Arts, Sport And Media: Oversight of RTÉ's Expenditure of Public Funds and Governance Issues and Plans for Longer-term Support and Funding for Public Service Media: Minister for Tourism, Culture, Arts, Gaeltacht, Sport and Media (27 Feb 2024)

Catherine Martin: It was actually in passing, and the language was in the future tense - it will now present a report; it will report to the board. It certainly was not clear, and this happened after Mr. Collins's package was agreed.

Joint Committee on Tourism, Culture, Arts, Sport And Media: Oversight of RTÉ's Expenditure of Public Funds and Governance Issues and Plans for Longer-term Support and Funding for Public Service Media: Minister for Tourism, Culture, Arts, Gaeltacht, Sport and Media (27 Feb 2024)

Catherine Martin: We had not received the terms of reference.

Joint Committee on Tourism, Culture, Arts, Sport And Media: Oversight of RTÉ's Expenditure of Public Funds and Governance Issues and Plans for Longer-term Support and Funding for Public Service Media: Minister for Tourism, Culture, Arts, Gaeltacht, Sport and Media (27 Feb 2024)

Catherine Martin: We still have not seen a formal notification of the terms of reference.

Joint Committee on Tourism, Culture, Arts, Sport And Media: Oversight of RTÉ's Expenditure of Public Funds and Governance Issues and Plans for Longer-term Support and Funding for Public Service Media: Minister for Tourism, Culture, Arts, Gaeltacht, Sport and Media (27 Feb 2024)

Catherine Martin: What transpired at that PAC meeting was that Ms Mullooly outlined changes. It sounded, as I said, that she did so using the future tense. In other words, that they would apply in the future. It was not obvious that they had taken effect.

Joint Committee on Tourism, Culture, Arts, Sport And Media: Oversight of RTÉ's Expenditure of Public Funds and Governance Issues and Plans for Longer-term Support and Funding for Public Service Media: Minister for Tourism, Culture, Arts, Gaeltacht, Sport and Media (27 Feb 2024)

Catherine Martin: Because you would presume that the chair would communicate that in a formal manner to the Minister.

Joint Committee on Tourism, Culture, Arts, Sport And Media: Oversight of RTÉ's Expenditure of Public Funds and Governance Issues and Plans for Longer-term Support and Funding for Public Service Media: Minister for Tourism, Culture, Arts, Gaeltacht, Sport and Media (27 Feb 2024)

Catherine Martin: This was only flagged two days after the Mr. Collins package - the fact that I had not been told that it had been approved by the board. Even the chair herself, up until last Wednesday, was saying the terms of reference would come into effect in the future, so the chair of the board was saying to me last week.

Joint Committee on Tourism, Culture, Arts, Sport And Media: Oversight of RTÉ's Expenditure of Public Funds and Governance Issues and Plans for Longer-term Support and Funding for Public Service Media: Minister for Tourism, Culture, Arts, Gaeltacht, Sport and Media (27 Feb 2024)

Catherine Martin: Because it was never explicitly advised to us that the terms of reference were in force and applied to the Richard Collins case. It was a process commenced in July. It was an ongoing case for three months.

Joint Committee on Tourism, Culture, Arts, Sport And Media: Oversight of RTÉ's Expenditure of Public Funds and Governance Issues and Plans for Longer-term Support and Funding for Public Service Media: Minister for Tourism, Culture, Arts, Gaeltacht, Sport and Media (27 Feb 2024)

Catherine Martin: I believe the officials have been doing an incredible job for the past eight months.

Joint Committee on Tourism, Culture, Arts, Sport And Media: Oversight of RTÉ's Expenditure of Public Funds and Governance Issues and Plans for Longer-term Support and Funding for Public Service Media: Minister for Tourism, Culture, Arts, Gaeltacht, Sport and Media (27 Feb 2024)

Catherine Martin: No.

Joint Committee on Tourism, Culture, Arts, Sport And Media: Oversight of RTÉ's Expenditure of Public Funds and Governance Issues and Plans for Longer-term Support and Funding for Public Service Media: Minister for Tourism, Culture, Arts, Gaeltacht, Sport and Media (27 Feb 2024)

Catherine Martin: As I said on Thursday, I was trying to afford every opportunity for that face-to-face meeting.

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