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Public Accounts Committee: Special Report No. 94 of the Comptroller and Auditor General: National Asset Management Agency Sale of Project Eagle (Resumed) (6 Oct 2016)

Shane Cassells: All I was saying was that the Minister had said in his opening remarks that he thought the Committee of Public Accounts was the correct forum in which to resolve all of those issues, but he was also forthright this afternoon, as is his remit and wont, in setting out clearly where he stood. Let me just say in his opening-----

Public Accounts Committee: Special Report No. 94 of the Comptroller and Auditor General: National Asset Management Agency Sale of Project Eagle (Resumed) (6 Oct 2016)

Shane Cassells: On the divergence of opinion and to help us, because the Chairman has to bring us together and write a report, did NAMA do a good job in the sale to maximise the interests of the taxpayer in the price it had achieved?

Public Accounts Committee: Special Report No. 94 of the Comptroller and Auditor General: National Asset Management Agency Sale of Project Eagle (Resumed) (6 Oct 2016)

Shane Cassells: I asked specifically about the deal, although I appreciate what the Minister set out in general.

Public Accounts Committee: Special Report No. 94 of the Comptroller and Auditor General: National Asset Management Agency Sale of Project Eagle (Resumed) (6 Oct 2016)

Shane Cassells: The Minister has stated NAMA did a good job. In his mind, is there no probable loss?

Public Accounts Committee: Special Report No. 94 of the Comptroller and Auditor General: National Asset Management Agency Sale of Project Eagle (Resumed) (6 Oct 2016)

Shane Cassells: That is why I am exploring it with the Minister for Finance.

Public Accounts Committee: Special Report No. 94 of the Comptroller and Auditor General: National Asset Management Agency Sale of Project Eagle (Resumed) (6 Oct 2016)

Shane Cassells: That is fine. As such, in the Minister's opinion, there was no probable loss.

Public Accounts Committee: Special Report No. 94 of the Comptroller and Auditor General: National Asset Management Agency Sale of Project Eagle (Resumed) (6 Oct 2016)

Shane Cassells: Excellent. That is why I am trying to engage with the Minister. As Deputy Marc MacSharry said, he was very young when the Minister was first in government. I do not think I was even born. The Minister is very experienced and I am trying to gain that knowledge to try to help me. I am asking him to help me.

Public Accounts Committee: Special Report No. 94 of the Comptroller and Auditor General: National Asset Management Agency Sale of Project Eagle (Resumed) (6 Oct 2016)

Shane Cassells: In his assessment the Minister has said he is keeping an open mind. At this point in time he does not believe there is a probable loss.

Public Accounts Committee: Special Report No. 94 of the Comptroller and Auditor General: National Asset Management Agency Sale of Project Eagle (Resumed) (6 Oct 2016)

Shane Cassells: When Frank Daly phoned the Minister about the PIMCO withdrawal and the Minister discussed it and the reasons for the withdrawal with Mr. Daly, did Mr. Daly assure him that there was a proper pathway for a competitive process to proceed?

Public Accounts Committee: Special Report No. 94 of the Comptroller and Auditor General: National Asset Management Agency Sale of Project Eagle (Resumed) (6 Oct 2016)

Shane Cassells: The Minister spoke about the divergence of opinion, trying to resolve it and the Committee of Public Accounts trying to resolve it. Reflecting on the events here last week, it got quite aggressive at times. It was nearly O.K. Corral stuff. Frank Daly certainly came in here with the holsters loaded and guns firmly pointed at the Comptroller and Auditor General's head, in the metaphorical...

Public Accounts Committee: Special Report No. 94 of the Comptroller and Auditor General: National Asset Management Agency Sale of Project Eagle (Resumed) (6 Oct 2016)

Shane Cassells: In respect of the process-----

Public Accounts Committee: Special Report No. 94 of the Comptroller and Auditor General: National Asset Management Agency Sale of Project Eagle (Resumed) (6 Oct 2016)

Shane Cassells: There are many other questions-----

Public Accounts Committee: Special Report No. 94 of the Comptroller and Auditor General: National Asset Management Agency Sale of Project Eagle (Resumed) (6 Oct 2016)

Shane Cassells: -----in respect of the record-keeping of NAMA-----

Public Accounts Committee: Special Report No. 94 of the Comptroller and Auditor General: National Asset Management Agency Sale of Project Eagle (Resumed) (6 Oct 2016)

Shane Cassells: The Minister just talked about the process. It evolves into a whole other scenario in that the Comptroller and Auditor General report details the record-keeping of NAMA and states that it was not adequate. The Minister will therefore understand how, from the media's point of view, a significant probe is happening outside by third parties in here when such a respected authority says that...

Public Accounts Committee: Special Report No. 94 of the Comptroller and Auditor General: National Asset Management Agency Sale of Project Eagle (Resumed) (6 Oct 2016)

Shane Cassells: That is fair enough, but in reflection, from the Minister's position, looking in and analysing this, does he find it strange that there are no minutes recording the change of tack and direction regarding the disposal of the portfolio? I ask him his opinion, again, just to inform myself. Does he find it strange?

Public Accounts Committee: Special Report No. 94 of the Comptroller and Auditor General: National Asset Management Agency Sale of Project Eagle (Resumed) (6 Oct 2016)

Shane Cassells: I think Mr. Daly did say that last week. He acknowledged that NAMA did not have a proper minute of that, and the Comptroller and Auditor General report-----

Public Accounts Committee: Special Report No. 94 of the Comptroller and Auditor General: National Asset Management Agency Sale of Project Eagle (Resumed) (6 Oct 2016)

Shane Cassells: I do not think there is even a minute of the change of direction.

Public Accounts Committee: Special Report No. 94 of the Comptroller and Auditor General: National Asset Management Agency Sale of Project Eagle (Resumed) (6 Oct 2016)

Shane Cassells: I also ask the Minister-----

Public Accounts Committee: Special Report No. 94 of the Comptroller and Auditor General: National Asset Management Agency Sale of Project Eagle (Resumed) (6 Oct 2016)

Shane Cassells: There was no detailed record in that respect.

Public Accounts Committee: Special Report No. 94 of the Comptroller and Auditor General: National Asset Management Agency Sale of Project Eagle (Resumed) (6 Oct 2016)

Shane Cassells: There was an earlier discussion here as well from the Northern Ireland perspective, from Deputies Cullinane and Farrell, about, as the Minister said, expeditious disposal of property. The Minister said there was an open competitive process. However, I will quote an interesting response Frank Daly gave last week to a question from Deputy Rock regarding the former's analysis from Northern...

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