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Financial Emergency Measures in the Public Interest (No. 2) Bill 2009: Second Stage (Resumed) (15 Dec 2009)

Dick Roche: One does not put public service reform into the budget.

Financial Emergency Measures in the Public Interest (No. 2) Bill 2009: Second Stage (Resumed) (15 Dec 2009)

Dick Roche: Public service reform must be dealt with.

Financial Emergency Measures in the Public Interest (No. 2) Bill 2009: Second Stage (Resumed) (15 Dec 2009)

Dick Roche: If the Members on the other side bear with me, they will here it.

Financial Emergency Measures in the Public Interest (No. 2) Bill 2009: Second Stage (Resumed) (15 Dec 2009)

Dick Roche: The concept of ministerial responsibility that we so slavishly adhere to is an expensive mythology that stymies public administration and stultifies political life in this country.

Financial Emergency Measures in the Public Interest (No. 2) Bill 2009: Second Stage (Resumed) (15 Dec 2009)

Dick Roche: A predecessor of the Deputy on the bench opposite in 1973 balked at this. I do not blame him because of the arguments that were put against him. I will send Deputy O'Donnell a copy of something I wrote on that. There has been much talk across the benches in this House about reform in public administration. I do not for a moment question the sincerity of what has been said about culling...

Financial Emergency Measures in the Public Interest (No. 2) Bill 2009: Second Stage (Resumed) (15 Dec 2009)

Dick Roche: -----or introducing more appropriate accounting systems or budgets that relate to performance.

Financial Emergency Measures in the Public Interest (No. 2) Bill 2009: Second Stage (Resumed) (15 Dec 2009)

Dick Roche: All of those things would be improvements in themselves, but real reform will only come to public administration in Ireland when we address the myth that lies at the heart of the way we do our business here, in the Civil Service and the wider public service. I will tell Deputy O'Donnell from where public service reform must come. It must come from each one of us in this House working together.

Financial Emergency Measures in the Public Interest (No. 2) Bill 2009: Second Stage (Resumed) (15 Dec 2009)

Dick Roche: Deputy O'Donnell is more intelligent than that. He knows full well, as I do, that if we are to introduce the root and branch reform that we need,-----

Financial Emergency Measures in the Public Interest (No. 2) Bill 2009: Second Stage (Resumed) (15 Dec 2009)

Dick Roche: -----we must take a long hard look, particularly at the Ministers and Secretaries Acts, where successive Members on both sides of this House-----

Financial Emergency Measures in the Public Interest (No. 2) Bill 2009: Second Stage (Resumed) (15 Dec 2009)

Dick Roche: The problem is that we all perpetuate the myth, particularly when we get into Opposition.

Financial Emergency Measures in the Public Interest (No. 2) Bill 2009: Second Stage (Resumed) (15 Dec 2009)

Dick Roche: What there must be to achieve real public service reform, and to change, in particular, the concept of ministerial responsibility, and to free the talent that is in the public administration,-----

Financial Emergency Measures in the Public Interest (No. 2) Bill 2009: Second Stage (Resumed) (15 Dec 2009)

Dick Roche: -----would be a cross-party agreement in this House to curtail that.

Financial Emergency Measures in the Public Interest (No. 2) Bill 2009: Second Stage (Resumed) (15 Dec 2009)

Dick Roche: It has never been there. Deputy Varadkar, who may not be familiar with this, should go back to the difficulties experienced by the then Minister, John Boland, when he tried to introduce these changes.

Financial Emergency Measures in the Public Interest (No. 2) Bill 2009: Second Stage (Resumed) (15 Dec 2009)

Dick Roche: Unfortunately, a great opportunity was lost.

Financial Emergency Measures in the Public Interest (No. 2) Bill 2009: Second Stage (Resumed) (15 Dec 2009)

Dick Roche: Perhaps at some stage, if those who are interested in listening as opposed to coming in and showing how silly they can be,-----

Financial Emergency Measures in the Public Interest (No. 2) Bill 2009: Second Stage (Resumed) (15 Dec 2009)

Dick Roche: -----if we were ever interested in having a real debate on public service reform, we could put aside time as a group of politicians to face the reality that Victorian legislation does not serve us.

Financial Emergency Measures in the Public Interest (No. 2) Bill 2009: Second Stage (Resumed) (15 Dec 2009)

Dick Roche: We all can make that decision.

Financial Emergency Measures in the Public Interest (No. 2) Bill 2009: Second Stage (Resumed) (15 Dec 2009)

Dick Roche: To correct the Deputy, the budget is not the place to achieve public service reform.

Financial Emergency Measures in the Public Interest (No. 2) Bill 2009: Second Stage (Resumed) (15 Dec 2009)

Dick Roche: Deputy Connaughton is probably the most.

Financial Emergency Measures in the Public Interest (No. 2) Bill 2009: Second Stage (Resumed) (15 Dec 2009)

Dick Roche: Not at all.

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