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Public Accounts Committee: 2012 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 38 - Health
Vote 39 - Health Service Executive
Section 38 - Agencies Remuneration
(19 Dec 2013)

John McGuinness: Okay. Regarding the establishment of hospital trusts, is the west-northwest trust the pilot model?

Public Accounts Committee: 2012 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 38 - Health
Vote 39 - Health Service Executive
Section 38 - Agencies Remuneration
(19 Dec 2013)

John McGuinness: To which agency are they accountable when it comes to their audits?

Public Accounts Committee: 2012 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 38 - Health
Vote 39 - Health Service Executive
Section 38 - Agencies Remuneration
(19 Dec 2013)

John McGuinness: Accordingly, they fall under the committee’s remit. Was the post for chief executive officer of the west-northwest hospital group advertised?

Public Accounts Committee: 2012 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 38 - Health
Vote 39 - Health Service Executive
Section 38 - Agencies Remuneration
(19 Dec 2013)

John McGuinness: There was no interview process, however.

Public Accounts Committee: 2012 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 38 - Health
Vote 39 - Health Service Executive
Section 38 - Agencies Remuneration
(19 Dec 2013)

John McGuinness: Was Dr. Ambrose McLoughlin appointed after an interview?

Public Accounts Committee: 2012 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 38 - Health
Vote 39 - Health Service Executive
Section 38 - Agencies Remuneration
(19 Dec 2013)

John McGuinness: Was Mr. Tony O’Brien’s appointment the same?

Public Accounts Committee: 2012 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 38 - Health
Vote 39 - Health Service Executive
Section 38 - Agencies Remuneration
(19 Dec 2013)

John McGuinness: How will the board of directors for the hospital group in question be appointed?

Public Accounts Committee: 2012 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 38 - Health
Vote 39 - Health Service Executive
Section 38 - Agencies Remuneration
(19 Dec 2013)

John McGuinness: How was it appointed?

Public Accounts Committee: 2012 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 38 - Health
Vote 39 - Health Service Executive
Section 38 - Agencies Remuneration
(19 Dec 2013)

John McGuinness: Are they HSE employees?

Public Accounts Committee: 2012 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 38 - Health
Vote 39 - Health Service Executive
Section 38 - Agencies Remuneration
(19 Dec 2013)

John McGuinness: Is Dr. Ambrose McLoughlin satisfied that public pay, procurement and promotion policies are being followed there?

Public Accounts Committee: 2012 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 38 - Health
Vote 39 - Health Service Executive
Section 38 - Agencies Remuneration
(19 Dec 2013)

John McGuinness: We know that. We have seen what people think of Mr. O’Brien’s letters. Many of them have not responded to them. Is that hospital group compliant with all HSE circulars?

Public Accounts Committee: 2012 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 38 - Health
Vote 39 - Health Service Executive
Section 38 - Agencies Remuneration
(19 Dec 2013)

John McGuinness: That is not the question. For years, non-compliance in the section 38 agencies was not brought to Mr. O’Brien’s attention. Is Mr. O’Brien happy with the governance in this hospital group? Are procurement policies for IT and so forth followed to the letter?

Public Accounts Committee: 2012 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 38 - Health
Vote 39 - Health Service Executive
Section 38 - Agencies Remuneration
(19 Dec 2013)

John McGuinness: At the last meeting, I asked about the use of hotels by the hospital group but no one knew about it. Are hotels used to accommodate staff or one member of staff of the group? Will Mr. O’Brien check that for me as well?

Public Accounts Committee: 2012 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 38 - Health
Vote 39 - Health Service Executive
Section 38 - Agencies Remuneration
(19 Dec 2013)

John McGuinness: The reason I raised this is because, unfortunately, Mr. O’Brien used the phrase a nod and a wink regarding section 38 agencies. There is still a lot of nodding and winking going on.

Public Accounts Committee: 2012 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 38 - Health
Vote 39 - Health Service Executive
Section 38 - Agencies Remuneration
(19 Dec 2013)

John McGuinness: This poor governance went on right across different Departments and agencies. People want that culture to be changed. I am not referring to individuals but that the culture needs to be changed.

Public Accounts Committee: 2012 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 38 - Health
Vote 39 - Health Service Executive
Section 38 - Agencies Remuneration
(19 Dec 2013)

John McGuinness: Will Ms Frances Spillane give a copy of it to the committee?

Public Accounts Committee: 2012 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 38 - Health
Vote 39 - Health Service Executive
Section 38 - Agencies Remuneration
(19 Dec 2013)

John McGuinness: Has St. Vincent’s come back on its compliance issues yet?

Public Accounts Committee: 2012 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 38 - Health
Vote 39 - Health Service Executive
Section 38 - Agencies Remuneration
(19 Dec 2013)

John McGuinness: I am waiting for the response and I would like to see it today. The committee will be here again tomorrow to consider this response. I thank the witnesses for attending the committee. I appreciate it has been a long day but they have been very helpful. I hope we will not see Mr. Barry O’Brien again before Christmas.

Public Accounts Committee: 2012 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 38 - Health
Vote 39 - Health Service Executive
Section 38 - Agencies Remuneration
(19 Dec 2013)

John McGuinness: I wish the delegations a Happy Christmas and thank them for their co-operation. I also thank the press and the members.

Public Accounts Committee: 2012 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 38 - Health
Vote 39 - Health Service Executive
Section 38 - Agencies Remuneration
(19 Dec 2013)

John McGuinness: I would point to the letter of 2009, which I raised again last week. Mr. Des Peelo of the Central Remedial Clinic wrote to Ms McGuinness at the HSE in 2009.

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