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Public Accounts Committee: City of Dublin Education and Training Board and Kilkenny and Carlow Education and Training Board: Financial Statements (16 Nov 2017)

Catherine Murphy: I would like to raise a final matter which, while a separate matter, is linked to procurement. We sometimes hear from suppliers that large organisations are favoured in terms of procurement, particularly in the supply of publications and so on. In France, there is a very low level of procurement outside of the State. The same applies in Germany yet here the reverse is the case. In terms...

Public Accounts Committee: City of Dublin Education and Training Board and Kilkenny and Carlow Education and Training Board: Financial Statements (16 Nov 2017)

Catherine Murphy: I am not suggesting for a minute that the ETB would not adhere to the procurement guidelines. The reason I asked the question was to find out if there are lessons we could learn from the direct experience. I have no further questions.

Public Accounts Committee: Tipperary Education and Training Board and Kildare and Wicklow Education and Training Board: Financial Statements (16 Nov 2017)

Catherine Murphy: I would prefer we stayed in public session.

Public Accounts Committee: Tipperary Education and Training Board and Kildare and Wicklow Education and Training Board: Financial Statements (16 Nov 2017)

Catherine Murphy: I would first like to ask Mr. McCarthy how unusual it is to issue a formal audit query. He obviously has a lot of engagement with the entities he audits, but how unusual is it to take that step?

Public Accounts Committee: Tipperary Education and Training Board and Kildare and Wicklow Education and Training Board: Financial Statements (16 Nov 2017)

Catherine Murphy: When the Comptroller and Auditor General had the engagement with, in this case, the KWETB, was it with the executive or with the board? Who was it with? What happens there?

Public Accounts Committee: Tipperary Education and Training Board and Kildare and Wicklow Education and Training Board: Financial Statements (16 Nov 2017)

Catherine Murphy: I will return to that particular point in a few minutes. I would like to ask Mr. Ó Foghlú about the formal inquiry that has been initiated in the Department. Is such a formal inquiry unusual? How often have such inquiries been initiated in the past five years?

Public Accounts Committee: Tipperary Education and Training Board and Kildare and Wicklow Education and Training Board: Financial Statements (16 Nov 2017)

Catherine Murphy: It is unusual. Regarding the Comptroller and Auditor General, has that happened? Is that unusual as well?

Public Accounts Committee: Tipperary Education and Training Board and Kildare and Wicklow Education and Training Board: Financial Statements (16 Nov 2017)

Catherine Murphy: The terms of reference were not cut and pasted. They were very deliberate.

Public Accounts Committee: Tipperary Education and Training Board and Kildare and Wicklow Education and Training Board: Financial Statements (16 Nov 2017)

Catherine Murphy: I would like to ask Mr. Ruttle about the board and the issue of governance, and about the relationship between the board and the executive. Does the same legal adviser work with both?

Public Accounts Committee: Tipperary Education and Training Board and Kildare and Wicklow Education and Training Board: Financial Statements (16 Nov 2017)

Catherine Murphy: Is there not a conflict or potential conflict there in the current environment?

Public Accounts Committee: Tipperary Education and Training Board and Kildare and Wicklow Education and Training Board: Financial Statements (16 Nov 2017)

Catherine Murphy: Following on from some of the earlier questions, has there been a conflation of the board and the executive?

Public Accounts Committee: Tipperary Education and Training Board and Kildare and Wicklow Education and Training Board: Financial Statements (16 Nov 2017)

Catherine Murphy: Yes.

Public Accounts Committee: Tipperary Education and Training Board and Kildare and Wicklow Education and Training Board: Financial Statements (16 Nov 2017)

Catherine Murphy: No. Is there a very clear separation between the board and the executive?

Public Accounts Committee: Tipperary Education and Training Board and Kildare and Wicklow Education and Training Board: Financial Statements (16 Nov 2017)

Catherine Murphy: In terms of putting items on the agenda and being made fully aware of, for example, the issues raised by the Comptroller and Auditor General, how transparent was that for the rest of the board?

Public Accounts Committee: Tipperary Education and Training Board and Kildare and Wicklow Education and Training Board: Financial Statements (16 Nov 2017)

Catherine Murphy: With regard to governance, was this a regular item for consideration on the board's agenda?

Public Accounts Committee: Tipperary Education and Training Board and Kildare and Wicklow Education and Training Board: Financial Statements (16 Nov 2017)

Catherine Murphy: Was Mr. Ruttle aware of the previous history in relation to report done by the Comptroller and Auditor General on the Kildare VEC?

Public Accounts Committee: Tipperary Education and Training Board and Kildare and Wicklow Education and Training Board: Financial Statements (16 Nov 2017)

Catherine Murphy: Was Mr. Ruttle not made aware of it?

Public Accounts Committee: Tipperary Education and Training Board and Kildare and Wicklow Education and Training Board: Financial Statements (16 Nov 2017)

Catherine Murphy: Mr. McCarthy gave us dates for when the report was done and then it would have found its way to the board after that. Could he give us the date on which there would have been a debate here, for example?

Public Accounts Committee: Tipperary Education and Training Board and Kildare and Wicklow Education and Training Board: Financial Statements (16 Nov 2017)

Catherine Murphy: The education and training boards were set up in 2013.

Public Accounts Committee: Tipperary Education and Training Board and Kildare and Wicklow Education and Training Board: Financial Statements (16 Nov 2017)

Catherine Murphy: Would that not have been put on a risk register? My question is for Mr. Ashe.

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