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Public Accounts Committee: 2015 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 20 - Garda Síochána - Internal Audit Report on Garda College, Templemore
(4 May 2017)

David Cullinane: -----which is very worrying in the light of the fact that this is An Garda Síochána. I asked who was the head of the finance directorate. I was told Mr. Culhane was.

Public Accounts Committee: 2015 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 20 - Garda Síochána - Internal Audit Report on Garda College, Templemore
(4 May 2017)

David Cullinane: Therefore, somebody else up the chain of command such as the Commissioner might be able to help me.

Public Accounts Committee: 2015 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 20 - Garda Síochána - Internal Audit Report on Garda College, Templemore
(4 May 2017)

David Cullinane: Yes, it was after that time. I want to move on and we can seek clarification as much we can at the end on the questions. On 6 July 2015, the executive director of human resources and people development delivered a report to the CEO entitled Summary of Issues Arising from the Reports and Discussions Held at the Garda College. I understand the purpose of the report was to prepare the CEO so...

Public Accounts Committee: 2015 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 20 - Garda Síochána - Internal Audit Report on Garda College, Templemore
(4 May 2017)

David Cullinane: Mr. Barrett. Was the report commissioned or done so that the Garda audit committee could be briefed? Was the Garda audit committee briefed?

Public Accounts Committee: 2015 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 20 - Garda Síochána - Internal Audit Report on Garda College, Templemore
(4 May 2017)

David Cullinane: Was it briefed?

Public Accounts Committee: 2015 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 20 - Garda Síochána - Internal Audit Report on Garda College, Templemore
(4 May 2017)

David Cullinane: Who made the decision not to brief?

Public Accounts Committee: 2015 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 20 - Garda Síochána - Internal Audit Report on Garda College, Templemore
(4 May 2017)

David Cullinane: Does anyone in the room know who made the decision not to brief?

Public Accounts Committee: 2015 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 20 - Garda Síochána - Internal Audit Report on Garda College, Templemore
(4 May 2017)

David Cullinane: Is Mr. Dunne in the room?

Public Accounts Committee: 2015 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 20 - Garda Síochána - Internal Audit Report on Garda College, Templemore
(4 May 2017)

David Cullinane: Is he the person who made the decision not to give the report?

Public Accounts Committee: 2015 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 20 - Garda Síochána - Internal Audit Report on Garda College, Templemore
(4 May 2017)

David Cullinane: I have questions about breaches in law which I will deal with very quickly but the final issue in respect of the report is that it was not just that meeting, it was raised again in September only under order of business, which is extraordinary.

Public Accounts Committee: 2015 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 20 - Garda Síochána - Internal Audit Report on Garda College, Templemore
(4 May 2017)

David Cullinane: I am referring to the meeting of 30 September.

Public Accounts Committee: 2015 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 20 - Garda Síochána - Internal Audit Report on Garda College, Templemore
(4 May 2017)

David Cullinane: I am reading from the internal audit itself where it says that it was mentioned under any other business and that copies of the report were not circulated to the committee members. Given that it was a serious report, is Mr. Ó Cualáin seriously telling me that it merited being raised under any other business?

Public Accounts Committee: 2015 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 20 - Garda Síochána - Internal Audit Report on Garda College, Templemore
(4 May 2017)

David Cullinane: Can Mr. Ó Cualáin see on page 16 where it says that at the audit committee meeting on 30 September the chief administrative officer gave an oral account of some of the issues under any other business? It is stated the report was not circulated to the committee.

Public Accounts Committee: 2015 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 20 - Garda Síochána - Internal Audit Report on Garda College, Templemore
(4 May 2017)

David Cullinane: I want to move on to the breaches in law very quickly but before I do, I wish to state that we need copies of all the reports-----

Public Accounts Committee: 2015 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 20 - Garda Síochána - Internal Audit Report on Garda College, Templemore
(4 May 2017)

David Cullinane: May I finish first?

Public Accounts Committee: 2015 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 20 - Garda Síochána - Internal Audit Report on Garda College, Templemore
(4 May 2017)

David Cullinane: It is not just copies of reports but also any correspondence between the Commissioner and all of the different individuals who are cited where there was an exchange of papers and reports and minutes of meetings that took place. Mr. Ó Cualáin said there was an extensive discussion at the committee meeting.

Public Accounts Committee: 2015 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 20 - Garda Síochána - Internal Audit Report on Garda College, Templemore
(4 May 2017)

David Cullinane: We need all of those minutes, correspondence and copies of the reports.

Public Accounts Committee: 2015 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 20 - Garda Síochána - Internal Audit Report on Garda College, Templemore
(4 May 2017)

David Cullinane: The final issue I want to raise relates to breaches in law. I am sure the Commissioner will accept that legislation is put in place for people to follow, implement and abide by and that any breach of legislation is essentially a breach in law. Is that the case? If one does not follow legislation it is potentially a breach in law.

Public Accounts Committee: 2015 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 20 - Garda Síochána - Internal Audit Report on Garda College, Templemore
(4 May 2017)

David Cullinane: Potentially, yes. On page 4 of the report it is stated that "the issues identified in this report are serious and present considerable risk to the organisation and should be dealt with in an open and transparent manner." On page 6 it is stated that Garda HRM would have to remind staff who are directors of Garda College Sports Field Company limited of their legal obligations to provide...

Public Accounts Committee: 2015 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 20 - Garda Síochána - Internal Audit Report on Garda College, Templemore
(4 May 2017)

David Cullinane: That is what the report states. Would that represent a breach in law?

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