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Bank Guarantee Scheme (30 Sep 2010)

Brian Lenihan Jnr: I take it the Deputy is not suggesting that bondholders with these institutions should be informed by the management thereof that they should now face a haircut.

Bank Guarantee Scheme (30 Sep 2010)

Brian Lenihan Jnr: I want to be clear about the matter.

Bank Guarantee Scheme (30 Sep 2010)

Brian Lenihan Jnr: I am trying to assist the Deputy who, I take it, is referring to senior bondholders in distressed institutions such as Anglo Irish Bank and Irish Nationwide where the total amount is substantially less than the figure to which the Deputy refers. I do not act on the basis of my own legal views, I act on the advice of the Attorney General who is the legal adviser to the Government.

Bank Guarantee Scheme (30 Sep 2010)

Brian Lenihan Jnr: The Attorney General provided advice with regard to legislative arrangements in respect of the treatment of bondholders in resolution law. His advice is that in the context of such resolution regimes, it is possible - in appropriately drawn circumstances - to give priority to the investment of taxpayers over subordinated debt in a distressed institution. In the case of senior bondholders,...

Bank Guarantee Scheme (30 Sep 2010)

Brian Lenihan Jnr: As the Deputy states, "pari passu" is the expression used by lawyers. That is the position. The relevant EU directive on the reorganisation of financial institutions makes clear that in reorganising such institutions one cannot differentiate or create an inequality between creditors. There are serious European and constitutional obstacles in the context of using legislation to effect that...

Bank Guarantee Scheme (30 Sep 2010)

Brian Lenihan Jnr: Deputy Bruton raised the matter of negotiation. Of course it is open to any financial institution to negotiate. I was not suggesting anything different. We must be careful with regard to how we use the word "negotiation". When Lehman Brothers collapsed, bondholders were invited to take part in negotiations. It is possible for senior bondholders to enter into discussions or negotiations...

Bank Guarantee Scheme (30 Sep 2010)

Brian Lenihan Jnr: I operated a one-man business for a substantial period of my existence so I am familiar with the factors to which the Deputy refers. Subordinated debt clearly ranks behind that relating to other creditors in an insolvency. That has always been recognised. The terms of these instruments often define their precise priority in the event of insolvency. That is the whole point. The Attorney...

Bank Guarantee Scheme (30 Sep 2010)

Brian Lenihan Jnr: When one states that one is inviting somebody to enter into negotiations, the outcome depends on how big a gun one is wielding.

Bank Guarantee Scheme (30 Sep 2010)

Brian Lenihan Jnr: That is the reality. If one invites somebody to enter into negotiations and one states that one will not pay, an element of coercion creeps into the equation.

Bank Guarantee Scheme (30 Sep 2010)

Brian Lenihan Jnr: I used the word "discussion" in substitution for that of "negotiation", which Deputy Burton used. It is clear that discussions take place and arrangements which may be of mutual advantage can be arrived at between financial institutions and senior bondholders. For example, a bondholder might-----

Bank Guarantee Scheme (30 Sep 2010)

Brian Lenihan Jnr: -----agree to a longer term by way of guaranteed deposit.

Bank Guarantee Scheme (30 Sep 2010)

Brian Lenihan Jnr: Two distinct issues arise. First, in the context of the current guarantee scheme, which, as a result of the House's decision last evening, provides for a comprehensive guarantee for all deposits, I accept that the end date of 31 December is awkward. That view is shared by the Commission. However, we must monitor market developments. It is clearly important for the State that we establish...

Bank Guarantee Scheme (30 Sep 2010)

Brian Lenihan Jnr: It is not a change in policy.

Bank Guarantee Scheme (30 Sep 2010)

Brian Lenihan Jnr: In respect of the charge of there being a change of policy, which the Deputy has repeated and which Deputy Burton made earlier-----

Bank Guarantee Scheme (30 Sep 2010)

Brian Lenihan Jnr: I can deal with it now.

Bank Guarantee Scheme (30 Sep 2010)

Brian Lenihan Jnr: It is a very big number of questions. On the suggestion that there is a change of policy, there is no change of policy. It is always open to senior bondholders and bank management to discuss arrangements of mutual advantage.

Bank Guarantee Scheme (30 Sep 2010)

Brian Lenihan Jnr: A suggestion of an invitation to negotiation under a threat is not in the same equation.

Bank Guarantee Scheme (30 Sep 2010)

Brian Lenihan Jnr: Deputy English asked about the cost of the guarantee. Taking the guarantee in isolation, clearly the State earned €1.025 billion in total fees under the two guarantee schemes to date.

Bank Guarantee Scheme (30 Sep 2010)

Brian Lenihan Jnr: It is pure profit because there was not cost for the guarantee.

Bank Guarantee Scheme (30 Sep 2010)

Brian Lenihan Jnr: I am. On the night the legislation was introduced in the House Deputy Burton asked about the question of capital. I replied to her by saying that it was in the first instance a matter for the institutions themselves to capitalise them and that we would go in deep to ascertain what the problems were. We have seen what the problems were. I will not have a chance to answer Deputy English's...

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