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Public Accounts Committee: 2015 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 20 - Garda Síochána - Internal Audit Report on Garda College, Templemore (Resumed)
(20 Jun 2017)

David Cullinane: The letter was written to the Commissioner, so obviously she would have received it. She would have read it. She would have had to consider what it said when she received it, although perhaps not in preparation for this meeting. I accept that, but she certainly would have received the letter. It says that at the meeting which took place - the meeting which Mr. Barrett says took over two...

Public Accounts Committee: 2015 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 20 - Garda Síochána - Internal Audit Report on Garda College, Templemore (Resumed)
(20 Jun 2017)

David Cullinane: It is the second paragraph in the letter.

Public Accounts Committee: 2015 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 20 - Garda Síochána - Internal Audit Report on Garda College, Templemore (Resumed)
(20 Jun 2017)

David Cullinane: The letter states, "I know the focus of that meeting, which was greater than two hours duration, was the written advices of Mr. Ken Ruane, Head of Legal Affairs ... and the 2008 report of Mr. Barry McGee which was appended to that lengthy letter from Mr. Ruane." Was the Commissioner aware of the existence of the 2008 report?

Public Accounts Committee: 2015 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 20 - Garda Síochána - Internal Audit Report on Garda College, Templemore (Resumed)
(20 Jun 2017)

David Cullinane: Was the letter or the McGee report appended to the lengthy letter from Mr. Ruane?

Public Accounts Committee: 2015 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 20 - Garda Síochána - Internal Audit Report on Garda College, Templemore (Resumed)
(20 Jun 2017)

David Cullinane: It then states that, on 30 June 2015 and again in early July, Mr. Cyril Dunne had brought these matters of critical concern, which I have been raising, to the Commissioner's personal attention. This was before 27 July, when the Commissioner says she first became aware of this. Is Mr Barrett right in saying that Mr. Dunne, on 30 June 2016 and again in early July, would have brought these...

Public Accounts Committee: 2015 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 20 - Garda Síochána - Internal Audit Report on Garda College, Templemore (Resumed)
(20 Jun 2017)

David Cullinane: I am asking for answers to questions. Is the Commissioner telling me that he is wrong to assert that Mr. Dunne briefed her on these matters of critical concern on 30 June and in early July?

Public Accounts Committee: 2015 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 20 - Garda Síochána - Internal Audit Report on Garda College, Templemore (Resumed)
(20 Jun 2017)

David Cullinane: He did not brief the Commissioner on the matters of critical concern.

Public Accounts Committee: 2015 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 20 - Garda Síochána - Internal Audit Report on Garda College, Templemore (Resumed)
(20 Jun 2017)

David Cullinane: It goes on to state that during the meeting, which was greater than two hours duration though the Commissioner says it was less, "time was spent discussing Mr. Ruane's suggestion that all key external stakeholders (the Minister for Justice and Equality, the Comptroller and Auditor General, the Secretary General of the Department of Justice and Equality) should immediately be notified before...

Public Accounts Committee: 2015 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 20 - Garda Síochána - Internal Audit Report on Garda College, Templemore (Resumed)
(20 Jun 2017)

David Cullinane: Is it accurate or inaccurate?

Public Accounts Committee: 2015 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 20 - Garda Síochána - Internal Audit Report on Garda College, Templemore (Resumed)
(20 Jun 2017)

David Cullinane: Ms O'Sullivan disagrees again with Mr. Barrett.

Public Accounts Committee: 2015 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 20 - Garda Síochána - Internal Audit Report on Garda College, Templemore (Resumed)
(20 Jun 2017)

David Cullinane: Mr. Barrett goes on to say it was clear from the evidence that the evidence given to the Committee of Public Accounts by the Commissioner on 31 May 2017, namely, her assertion that she was first informed of these matters on 27 July 2015, was not correct. He respectfully suggested that she corrects the Dáil record in that regard and on the actual duration of the meeting on the evening of...

Public Accounts Committee: 2015 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 20 - Garda Síochána - Internal Audit Report on Garda College, Templemore (Resumed)
(20 Jun 2017)

David Cullinane: Mr. Barrett says the Commissioner's testimony on 31 May is not correct. I ask her to put herself in my shoes, as a Teachta Dála and a member of this committee. The head of human resources in An Garda Síochána writes a letter to the Commissioner stating that he does not believe the information she gave to this committee is correct. Does she understand how that causes me...

Public Accounts Committee: 2015 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 20 - Garda Síochána - Internal Audit Report on Garda College, Templemore (Resumed)
(20 Jun 2017)

David Cullinane: Does the Commissioner accept that he says in the letter that it was not correct?

Public Accounts Committee: 2015 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 20 - Garda Síochána - Internal Audit Report on Garda College, Templemore (Resumed)
(20 Jun 2017)

David Cullinane: Did the Commissioner write back to ask for clarity from him as to exactly what was incorrect?

Public Accounts Committee: 2015 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 20 - Garda Síochána - Internal Audit Report on Garda College, Templemore (Resumed)
(20 Jun 2017)

David Cullinane: It is dated 12 June.

Public Accounts Committee: 2015 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 20 - Garda Síochána - Internal Audit Report on Garda College, Templemore (Resumed)
(20 Jun 2017)

David Cullinane: I have one final question relating to the letter the Commissioner gave to the Comptroller and Auditor General. We had a lengthy discussion on the use of the word "irregular", a word she used when first responding to my questions on whether she had acted appropriately. She said she had done and took the right corrective action, saying she wanted to "regularise" accounting practices. This...

Public Accounts Committee: 2015 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 20 - Garda Síochána - Internal Audit Report on Garda College, Templemore (Resumed)
(20 Jun 2017)

David Cullinane: That is quite serious.

Public Accounts Committee: 2015 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 20 - Garda Síochána - Internal Audit Report on Garda College, Templemore (Resumed)
(20 Jun 2017)

David Cullinane: I was here.

Public Accounts Committee: 2015 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 20 - Garda Síochána - Internal Audit Report on Garda College, Templemore (Resumed)
(20 Jun 2017)

David Cullinane: I want to be respectful to the Commissioner. I have listened to what she said and have sat through all the meetings on these hearings. All I want to do is establish the facts and the truth. The Commissioner weaves one narrative when asked questions on what she did because she wants to point out that on 27 July when she said she first became aware of this, she did everything she possibly...

Public Accounts Committee: 2015 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 20 - Garda Síochána - Internal Audit Report on Garda College, Templemore (Resumed)
(20 Jun 2017)

David Cullinane: That is the view of the Comptroller and Auditor General. That is very serious because these letters give this committee the assurance it needs. I do not have an assurance that the Commissioner acted appropriately.

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