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Select Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: National Shared Services Office Bill 2016: Committee Stage (22 Jun 2017)

David Cullinane: Okay. Will the accounts of the office that will be established be audited by the Comptroller and Auditor General?

Select Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: National Shared Services Office Bill 2016: Committee Stage (22 Jun 2017)

David Cullinane: Will the CEO appear before the Committee of Public Accounts for scrutiny?

Select Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: National Shared Services Office Bill 2016: Committee Stage (22 Jun 2017)

David Cullinane: The spend on consultancy or advisers' fees or any spend would be fully scrutinised by the Committee of Public Accounts, as with all other agencies. Is that correct?

Select Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: National Shared Services Office Bill 2016: Committee Stage (22 Jun 2017)

David Cullinane: Why would there be an objection to stating explicitly that: "The Office shall, at the request in writing from the Committee of Public Accounts, make available to the Committee of Public Accounts information regarding any costs or fees...". What I am taking from the Minister's remarks is that he believes this will happen anyway. In order that it is clear and explicit, why would the Minister...

Select Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: National Shared Services Office Bill 2016: Committee Stage (22 Jun 2017)

David Cullinane: I accept what the Minister of State is saying, but may I have some guidance in regard to Report Stage? What is the procedure if I reserve the right to come back to this amendment on Report Stage? Do I withdraw the amendment and resubmit it on Report Stage?

Select Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: National Shared Services Office Bill 2016: Committee Stage (22 Jun 2017)

David Cullinane: Section 17(1) states: ""Committee" means a Committee appointed by either House of the Oireachtas or jointly by both Houses of the Oireachtas (other than the Committee referred to in section 19 of the Comptroller and Auditor General (Amendment) Act...". What committee is that? My understanding is that is the Committee of Public Accounts.

Select Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: National Shared Services Office Bill 2016: Committee Stage (22 Jun 2017)

David Cullinane: If we are talking about the accountability of the chief executive to the Oireachtas in this section "committee" means all committees which are sectoral committees other than Committee of Public Accounts.

Select Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: National Shared Services Office Bill 2016: Committee Stage (22 Jun 2017)

David Cullinane: It is relevant but now that the Minister of State has given me that information, I will withdraw the amendment we are discussing and reserve the right to resubmit it on Report Stage.

Select Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: National Shared Services Office Bill 2016: Committee Stage (22 Jun 2017)

David Cullinane: I move amendment No. 14:In page 12, lines 29 to 31, to delete all words from and including "the" where it secondly occurs in line 29 down to and including "or" where it firstly occurs in line 31.

Select Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: National Shared Services Office Bill 2016: Committee Stage (22 Jun 2017)

David Cullinane: Is that amendments Nos. 14 and 15?

Select Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: National Shared Services Office Bill 2016: Committee Stage (22 Jun 2017)

David Cullinane: I move amendment No. 15:In page 13, between lines 23 and 24, to insert the following:"(9) The chief executive shall be an accounting officer for the purposes of section 19 of the Comptroller and Auditor General (Amendment) Act 1993.".

Select Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: National Shared Services Office Bill 2016: Committee Stage (22 Jun 2017)

David Cullinane: I move amendment No. 17:In page 14, between lines 23 and 24, to insert the following:"(8) For the purposes of this Act only, members of the Board are not employees under section 8 and section 9 of the Protection of Employees (Fixed-Term Work) Act 2003.". This relates to the use of that section by board members of semi-State bodies to attain contracts of indefinite duration. As the Minister...

Select Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: National Shared Services Office Bill 2016: Committee Stage (22 Jun 2017)

David Cullinane: I move amendment No. 18:In page 15, line 32, after "determine" to insert "subject to review by the Committee as defined under section 17of this Act". The Minister of State will be aware that there have been many scandals about pay and allowances for board members, some of which has been fair, some in my view, unfair. There has been much public commentary on these issues. There has to be...

Select Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: National Shared Services Office Bill 2016: Committee Stage (22 Jun 2017)

David Cullinane: I have listened to the Minister of State's response and will make one additional point before withdrawing the amendment, reserving the right to resubmit it on Report Stage. The chief executive would have leeway and in this amendment we are trying to limit that leeway because we do not want to see someone appearing before this committee for exceeding public sector pay or allowances in respect...

Public Accounts Committee: Business of Committee (22 Jun 2017)

David Cullinane: Who is that from?

Public Accounts Committee: Business of Committee (22 Jun 2017)

David Cullinane: May I make one comment on that?

Public Accounts Committee: Business of Committee (22 Jun 2017)

David Cullinane: We only received this letter on the day of the hearing. It was a very important letter and we probably did not get enough chance to properly go through it with the Commissioner because we only got it. I note that for the Cathaoirleach. We have completed our work in terms of our hearings and we will move to a report. This was Mr. Barrett, who is head of human resources, asking the...

Public Accounts Committee: Business of Committee (22 Jun 2017)

David Cullinane: We should get a formal response from her.

Public Accounts Committee: Business of Committee (22 Jun 2017)

David Cullinane: I know it is only his view and people are entitled to different views.

Public Accounts Committee: Business of Committee (22 Jun 2017)

David Cullinane: We also need clarity because probably more important is the last line. This is the meeting where there was a dispute as to how long the meeting went on. It says, "In addition, time was spent discussing Mr. Ruane's suggestion that all key external stakeholders (the Minister for Justice and Equality, the Comptroller and Auditor General, the Secretary General of the Department of Justice and...

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