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Public Accounts Committee: Caranua Financial Statements 2017 (17 Oct 2019)

Catherine Connolly: Cuirim fáilte roimh na daoine a bhí anseo cheana agus roimh Ms Rachel Downes, atá anseo don chéad uair. Our guests are very welcome. Ms Downes was not here before, but the board has been here. I thank her for the briefing documents and the financial accounts. I have read them all. It was indicated on the risk register that money was still outstanding from the...

Public Accounts Committee: Caranua Financial Statements 2017 (17 Oct 2019)

Catherine Connolly: That is okay. It is still on the risk register. I imagine it is very difficult for the board to make decisions because it does not know how much money it has. What has the Department said about when Caranua will get the money? What is the total amount outstanding?

Public Accounts Committee: Caranua Financial Statements 2017 (17 Oct 2019)

Catherine Connolly: Is it exactly €3 million?

Public Accounts Committee: Caranua Financial Statements 2017 (17 Oct 2019)

Catherine Connolly: Was it due last May? It was due at various stages. When will it be handed over?

Public Accounts Committee: Caranua Financial Statements 2017 (17 Oct 2019)

Catherine Connolly: Has Caranua come to an agreement? Is it with the Christian Brothers predominantly or is there anybody else involved?

Public Accounts Committee: Caranua Financial Statements 2017 (17 Oct 2019)

Catherine Connolly: The sum of €3.3 million has been outstanding for quite some time. Is it correct that the agreement goes back to 2009?

Public Accounts Committee: Caranua Financial Statements 2017 (17 Oct 2019)

Catherine Connolly: From 2009 to 2019 is a period of ten years. Is it correct that Caranua has agreed a schedule of payments with the Christian Brothers and that will be done in November and December?

Public Accounts Committee: Caranua Financial Statements 2017 (17 Oct 2019)

Catherine Connolly: Will that be it? Will the Christian Brothers be paying more to Caranua than is needed in order to comply with the legislation?

Public Accounts Committee: Caranua Financial Statements 2017 (17 Oct 2019)

Catherine Connolly: Is the excess going to the national children's hospital?

Public Accounts Committee: Caranua Financial Statements 2017 (17 Oct 2019)

Catherine Connolly: Is there something else as well?

Public Accounts Committee: Caranua Financial Statements 2017 (17 Oct 2019)

Catherine Connolly: I understand all that. Caranua gets up to €110 million plus the interest.

Public Accounts Committee: Caranua Financial Statements 2017 (17 Oct 2019)

Catherine Connolly: And the other surplus from the Christian Brothers is going to the national children's hospital.

Public Accounts Committee: Caranua Financial Statements 2017 (17 Oct 2019)

Catherine Connolly: Why did it take so long?

Public Accounts Committee: Caranua Financial Statements 2017 (17 Oct 2019)

Catherine Connolly: Did the Department discuss with the board the difficulties created by the fact that it did not have the total amount and could not plan?

Public Accounts Committee: Caranua Financial Statements 2017 (17 Oct 2019)

Catherine Connolly: I saw all that. My question is how the board and the Department handled that difficulty when they did not know how much money they had. Caranua is in a wind-up situation and it is only getting the money now.

Public Accounts Committee: Caranua Financial Statements 2017 (17 Oct 2019)

Catherine Connolly: That is okay. I understand that.

Public Accounts Committee: Caranua Financial Statements 2017 (17 Oct 2019)

Catherine Connolly: I am glad he did. I have recognised that. I have read the minutes. I saw that it was discussed and that the board took it seriously. It was a very sensible thing to do, but it is not a good way in which to have to run an organisation. I am not getting a clear answer as to why the money was not paid over beforehand. In any case, that is fine. My questions to Ms Downes are not personal...

Public Accounts Committee: Caranua Financial Statements 2017 (17 Oct 2019)

Catherine Connolly: What period of overlap?

Public Accounts Committee: Caranua Financial Statements 2017 (17 Oct 2019)

Catherine Connolly: So for two months, two CEOs, one acting and one not acting, were paid.

Public Accounts Committee: Caranua Financial Statements 2017 (17 Oct 2019)

Catherine Connolly: I am not going into the personal details. I reassure Ms Downes of that. This arose previously. It is none of my business. What is my business is value for money. For a period of two months, two salaries were paid to two CEOs, one acting and one not acting, for various reasons.

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