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Public Accounts Committee: Procurement Issues: Small Firms Association and Irish Schools Arts Supply Federation (5 Mar 2015)

John McGuinness: Deputy Perry is missing the point.

Public Accounts Committee: Procurement Issues: Small Firms Association and Irish Schools Arts Supply Federation (5 Mar 2015)

John McGuinness: Sorry, I am going to rule on this. We have learned a lot from the group that is before us. We will shortly commence our next session with the Department. I am bringing this part of the meeting to a conclusion. After our next session we will consider what would be required to ensure these small firms are protected and included in any procurement process.

Public Accounts Committee: Procurement Issues: Small Firms Association and Irish Schools Arts Supply Federation (5 Mar 2015)

John McGuinness: Sorry, Deputy-----

Public Accounts Committee: Procurement Issues: Small Firms Association and Irish Schools Arts Supply Federation (5 Mar 2015)

John McGuinness: The Deputy has made his point. I am adjourning the meeting for ten minutes and then we will have the officials.

Public Accounts Committee: Procurement Issues: Small Firms Association and Irish Schools Arts Supply Federation (5 Mar 2015)

John McGuinness: The Deputy can put his points to the officials. He is not going to deal with it now.

Public Accounts Committee: 2013 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General Appropriation Accounts
Vote 11 - Office of the Minister for Public Expenditure and Reform
Vote 12 - Superannuation and Retired Allowances
Vote 18 - Shared Services
Special Report No. 87 - Effectiveness of Audit Committees in State Bodies
Issues with Public Procurement
(5 Mar 2015)

John McGuinness: We will deal now with Vote No. 11- Office of the Minister for Public Expenditure and Reform, Vote 12 - Superannuation and Retired Allowances; Vote - 18 Share Services and the Comptroller and Auditor General's special report 87 - Effectiveness of Audit Committees in State Bodies and issues with Procurement. Before we begin, I remindmembers, witnesses and those in the Visitors Gallery to please...

Public Accounts Committee: 2013 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General Appropriation Accounts
Vote 11 - Office of the Minister for Public Expenditure and Reform
Vote 12 - Superannuation and Retired Allowances
Vote 18 - Shared Services
Special Report No. 87 - Effectiveness of Audit Committees in State Bodies
Issues with Public Procurement
(5 Mar 2015)

John McGuinness: Thank you. I now invite Mr. McCarthy to make his opening statement.

Public Accounts Committee: 2013 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General Appropriation Accounts
Vote 11 - Office of the Minister for Public Expenditure and Reform
Vote 12 - Superannuation and Retired Allowances
Vote 18 - Shared Services
Special Report No. 87 - Effectiveness of Audit Committees in State Bodies
Issues with Public Procurement
(5 Mar 2015)

John McGuinness: I thank Mr. Watt. Can we publish his statement?

Public Accounts Committee: 2013 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General Appropriation Accounts
Vote 11 - Office of the Minister for Public Expenditure and Reform
Vote 12 - Superannuation and Retired Allowances
Vote 18 - Shared Services
Special Report No. 87 - Effectiveness of Audit Committees in State Bodies
Issues with Public Procurement
(5 Mar 2015)

John McGuinness: What is the witnesses' definition of a medium company?

Public Accounts Committee: 2013 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General Appropriation Accounts
Vote 11 - Office of the Minister for Public Expenditure and Reform
Vote 12 - Superannuation and Retired Allowances
Vote 18 - Shared Services
Special Report No. 87 - Effectiveness of Audit Committees in State Bodies
Issues with Public Procurement
(5 Mar 2015)

John McGuinness: What is your definition?

Public Accounts Committee: 2013 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General Appropriation Accounts
Vote 11 - Office of the Minister for Public Expenditure and Reform
Vote 12 - Superannuation and Retired Allowances
Vote 18 - Shared Services
Special Report No. 87 - Effectiveness of Audit Committees in State Bodies
Issues with Public Procurement
(5 Mar 2015)

John McGuinness: What is a small company?

Public Accounts Committee: 2013 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General Appropriation Accounts
Vote 11 - Office of the Minister for Public Expenditure and Reform
Vote 12 - Superannuation and Retired Allowances
Vote 18 - Shared Services
Special Report No. 87 - Effectiveness of Audit Committees in State Bodies
Issues with Public Procurement
(5 Mar 2015)

John McGuinness: What is a micro-company?

Public Accounts Committee: 2013 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General Appropriation Accounts
Vote 11 - Office of the Minister for Public Expenditure and Reform
Vote 12 - Superannuation and Retired Allowances
Vote 18 - Shared Services
Special Report No. 87 - Effectiveness of Audit Committees in State Bodies
Issues with Public Procurement
(5 Mar 2015)

John McGuinness: Some of those who attended this morning are still with us in the Gallery. Is Mr. Watt suggesting he can meet them next week? What kind of timeframe are we talking about?

Public Accounts Committee: 2013 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General Appropriation Accounts
Vote 11 - Office of the Minister for Public Expenditure and Reform
Vote 12 - Superannuation and Retired Allowances
Vote 18 - Shared Services
Special Report No. 87 - Effectiveness of Audit Committees in State Bodies
Issues with Public Procurement
(5 Mar 2015)

John McGuinness: I understand.

Public Accounts Committee: 2013 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General Appropriation Accounts
Vote 11 - Office of the Minister for Public Expenditure and Reform
Vote 12 - Superannuation and Retired Allowances
Vote 18 - Shared Services
Special Report No. 87 - Effectiveness of Audit Committees in State Bodies
Issues with Public Procurement
(5 Mar 2015)

John McGuinness: What alarmed me about the exchange earlier this morning was that those who attended indicated that if the rules did not change almost immediately, they would not be here to talk to us next year. The other alarming statement came from Mr. Noonan; I am hope I am paraphrasing him correctly but he indicated the office was not fit for purpose. That is what he said. That concerns me. The...

Public Accounts Committee: 2013 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General Appropriation Accounts
Vote 11 - Office of the Minister for Public Expenditure and Reform
Vote 12 - Superannuation and Retired Allowances
Vote 18 - Shared Services
Special Report No. 87 - Effectiveness of Audit Committees in State Bodies
Issues with Public Procurement
(5 Mar 2015)

John McGuinness: Okay.

Public Accounts Committee: 2013 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General Appropriation Accounts
Vote 11 - Office of the Minister for Public Expenditure and Reform
Vote 12 - Superannuation and Retired Allowances
Vote 18 - Shared Services
Special Report No. 87 - Effectiveness of Audit Committees in State Bodies
Issues with Public Procurement
(5 Mar 2015)

John McGuinness: To finish on the procurement process, predatory pricing was also raised earlier. I know it was agreed to hold a meeting on this matter. Members of the Committee of Public Accounts should be notified of this meeting, so that they can attend if they want to. Another question that has been raised with us concerns having a survey on the impact current policy has on this small group of...

Public Accounts Committee: 2013 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General Appropriation Accounts
Vote 11 - Office of the Minister for Public Expenditure and Reform
Vote 12 - Superannuation and Retired Allowances
Vote 18 - Shared Services
Special Report No. 87 - Effectiveness of Audit Committees in State Bodies
Issues with Public Procurement
(5 Mar 2015)

John McGuinness: I wish to raise a couple of issues about the Secretary General's correspondence received this morning and dated 4 March. It reads, "[T]he changes or developments that are necessary to enable the PAC to examine monies that went into Irish Water". We are currently doing so on the basis that the Department suggested.

Public Accounts Committee: 2013 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General Appropriation Accounts
Vote 11 - Office of the Minister for Public Expenditure and Reform
Vote 12 - Superannuation and Retired Allowances
Vote 18 - Shared Services
Special Report No. 87 - Effectiveness of Audit Committees in State Bodies
Issues with Public Procurement
(5 Mar 2015)

John McGuinness: That work will be ongoing over a number of years, according to the plan that we sought when we dealt with the Department. It is something we can easily pursue.

Public Accounts Committee: 2013 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General Appropriation Accounts
Vote 11 - Office of the Minister for Public Expenditure and Reform
Vote 12 - Superannuation and Retired Allowances
Vote 18 - Shared Services
Special Report No. 87 - Effectiveness of Audit Committees in State Bodies
Issues with Public Procurement
(5 Mar 2015)

John McGuinness: The local government issue is a little more difficult. The Secretary General has not been much help to us on that in his letter. On the last occasion, he suggested there might be a role for us.

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