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Committee of Inquiry into the Banking Crisis: Nexus Phase (17 Jun 2015)

Susan O'Keeffe: Various people have given evidence here, including Mary O'Dea and others, that the damage, if you like, to want to put it in the broad term, was done by 2005-2006, that in other words we were always going to be scrambling thereafter. Would you accept that?

Committee of Inquiry into the Banking Crisis: Nexus Phase (17 Jun 2015)

Susan O'Keeffe: Where do you think the damage was done in that case?

Committee of Inquiry into the Banking Crisis: Nexus Phase (17 Jun 2015)

Susan O'Keeffe: But 2007 didn't occur in isolation. I think you'd agree that there had been-----

Committee of Inquiry into the Banking Crisis: Nexus Phase (17 Jun 2015)

Susan O'Keeffe: And I'm asking about your tenure and what momentum you believe, or not, was built up, and what your ... you and your Department's responsibility might have been during that time. And I'm just trying to gauge how responsible do you believe you might have been, your Department in that time, for what happened.

Committee of Inquiry into the Banking Crisis: Nexus Phase (17 Jun 2015)

Susan O'Keeffe: -----now, thank you.

Committee of Inquiry into the Banking Crisis: Nexus Phase (17 Jun 2015)

Susan O'Keeffe: Sorry, just to interrupt you for a second, Mr. Considine. Just set aside the Central Bank for a moment, because I'm going to come back to that. I'm actually talking here about the Department of Finance and, if you like, your ... your relationship with the Minister, and how it arose that during that period of time, you know, tax breaks were introduced, serious tax reductions were made at...

Committee of Inquiry into the Banking Crisis: Nexus Phase (17 Jun 2015)

Susan O'Keeffe: How did you rate that advice?

Committee of Inquiry into the Banking Crisis: Nexus Phase (17 Jun 2015)

Susan O'Keeffe: Is that how you describe it, Mr. Considine, "horse trading", that's what goes on before a budget?

Committee of Inquiry into the Banking Crisis: Nexus Phase (17 Jun 2015)

Susan O'Keeffe: But, Mr. Considine, most members of the public would believe that a Government, a Cabinet would sit down and construct a budget that was appropriate for the country and for its economy and for its sound economy, and that civil servants advising any Government would also have that in mind, and that it not be a moment for horse trading, for people trying to take their piece so I'm-----

Committee of Inquiry into the Banking Crisis: Nexus Phase (17 Jun 2015)

Susan O'Keeffe: So how did it end up that the Indecon report in 2006 valued the property-based tax breaks that had been granted in the previous years at costing the State €6.8 billion? How did that arise if what you were doing, you and everybody else, was in the pursuit of a sound economy?

Committee of Inquiry into the Banking Crisis: Nexus Phase (17 Jun 2015)

Susan O'Keeffe: I'm looking at the total price of it and I am saying €6.8 billion is a considerable sum or perhaps you don't think it is. I'm not sure.

Committee of Inquiry into the Banking Crisis: Nexus Phase (17 Jun 2015)

Susan O'Keeffe: So how did it arise that these tax breaks came at the cost they did and at the extent they did if you were of a different mindset?

Committee of Inquiry into the Banking Crisis: Nexus Phase (17 Jun 2015)

Susan O'Keeffe: So it was a political decision.

Committee of Inquiry into the Banking Crisis: Nexus Phase (17 Jun 2015)

Susan O'Keeffe: So how then ... just explain to us what happens then if you as a Secretary General are giving advice based on your Department's experience and capacity, and you bring that advice to a Minister and a Cabinet and they say, "Well yes, political ...". Just explain what happens there? Is it another sort of horse trading?

Committee of Inquiry into the Banking Crisis: Nexus Phase (17 Jun 2015)

Susan O'Keeffe: What words would you use to describe the level of tax breaks and the level of spend that occurred in that period of time? Looking at it, what words would you use, now that you are at this inquiry? You may not have been able to do it before, but perhaps you can have the opportunity now.

Committee of Inquiry into the Banking Crisis: Nexus Phase (17 Jun 2015)

Susan O'Keeffe: Well, perhaps you can do it in public now I mean, not in private.

Committee of Inquiry into the Banking Crisis: Nexus Phase (17 Jun 2015)

Susan O'Keeffe: No, I wasn't suggesting that. I meant this is a public arena and you have the opportunity now.

Committee of Inquiry into the Banking Crisis: Nexus Phase (17 Jun 2015)

Susan O'Keeffe: Sorry, Mr. Considine, I'm just asking if you might just tell me what you think of what happened. Just what words would you use to describe the level of spend and the amount of tax breaks that occurred in that period of time?

Committee of Inquiry into the Banking Crisis: Nexus Phase (17 Jun 2015)

Susan O'Keeffe: Good, bad or indifferent?

Committee of Inquiry into the Banking Crisis: Nexus Phase (17 Jun 2015)

Susan O'Keeffe: Yes, I suppose because you were a person with considerable experience of the Department of Finance, I'm interested in your own view of what happened at that time as you are now in front of this inquiry. Your view, not the evidence, your opinion and your view.

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