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Public Accounts Committee: National Paediatric Hospital Development Board: Financial Statements 2017 (Resumed) (16 May 2019)

Catherine Murphy: Was Mr. Quinn a supporter of this two-phase process? Did he buy into it?

Public Accounts Committee: National Paediatric Hospital Development Board: Financial Statements 2017 (Resumed) (16 May 2019)

Catherine Murphy: Did the board have a disagreement about it?

Public Accounts Committee: National Paediatric Hospital Development Board: Financial Statements 2017 (Resumed) (16 May 2019)

Catherine Murphy: As such, the board did identify cost risks.

Public Accounts Committee: National Paediatric Hospital Development Board: Financial Statements 2017 (Resumed) (16 May 2019)

Catherine Murphy: What did the board do to mitigate those risks?

Public Accounts Committee: National Paediatric Hospital Development Board: Financial Statements 2017 (Resumed) (16 May 2019)

Catherine Murphy: I will read from the minutes of May 2014, featured on page 3 of a briefing document dated 12 March. They say that the second part, comprising the remainder of the building contract, would be tendered using a bill of approximate quantities, with PC, prime cost, provisional sums for large work packages such as mechanical or electrical works. Both parts would be tendered at the same time.

Public Accounts Committee: National Paediatric Hospital Development Board: Financial Statements 2017 (Resumed) (16 May 2019)

Catherine Murphy: All of the evidence suggests that the board nailed costs down at the beginning. How could the board nail down the costs of the construction phase at the beginning when it did not have a detailed design?

Public Accounts Committee: National Paediatric Hospital Development Board: Financial Statements 2017 (Resumed) (16 May 2019)

Catherine Murphy: They were tendered at the same time. It is approximate.

Public Accounts Committee: National Paediatric Hospital Development Board: Financial Statements 2017 (Resumed) (16 May 2019)

Catherine Murphy: I really have to cut Mr. Quinn off because I want to ask other questions.

Public Accounts Committee: National Paediatric Hospital Development Board: Financial Statements 2017 (Resumed) (16 May 2019)

Catherine Murphy: I will stop Mr. Quinn there because I have to pursue this line that I want to pursue. What other example in this country of a two-phase tendered major public construction project was he basing this on? What had been done before that he was using as an example?

Public Accounts Committee: National Paediatric Hospital Development Board: Financial Statements 2017 (Resumed) (16 May 2019)

Catherine Murphy: We heard earlier that there were penalties if one had to go back and re-tender when one got to the detailed phase. Was that factored in?

Public Accounts Committee: National Paediatric Hospital Development Board: Financial Statements 2017 (Resumed) (16 May 2019)

Catherine Murphy: That is at variance with what I heard.

Public Accounts Committee: National Paediatric Hospital Development Board: Financial Statements 2017 (Resumed) (16 May 2019)

Catherine Murphy: I understand that part of it. Who drew up the documents? Did a consultancy firm draw up the documents in relation to the two-phase process? Who was that?

Public Accounts Committee: National Paediatric Hospital Development Board: Financial Statements 2017 (Resumed) (16 May 2019)

Catherine Murphy: Was a consultancy firm involved?

Public Accounts Committee: National Paediatric Hospital Development Board: Financial Statements 2017 (Resumed) (16 May 2019)

Catherine Murphy: Did Mr. Quinn test this two-phase process? Did he ask for advice outside the board?

Public Accounts Committee: National Paediatric Hospital Development Board: Financial Statements 2017 (Resumed) (16 May 2019)

Catherine Murphy: We have in-house expertise as well, for example, associated with the Department of Finance, which watches - perhaps not quite - costs. There is, for example, expertise in the OPW.

Public Accounts Committee: National Paediatric Hospital Development Board: Financial Statements 2017 (Resumed) (16 May 2019)

Catherine Murphy: Did Mr. Quinn asked its staff?

Public Accounts Committee: National Paediatric Hospital Development Board: Financial Statements 2017 (Resumed) (16 May 2019)

Catherine Murphy: Were there reservations, if Mr. Quinn consulted them?

Public Accounts Committee: National Paediatric Hospital Development Board: Financial Statements 2017 (Resumed) (16 May 2019)

Catherine Murphy: Was the imperative to get this done on time a higher priority than being within budget?

Public Accounts Committee: National Paediatric Hospital Development Board: Financial Statements 2017 (Resumed) (16 May 2019)

Catherine Murphy: I do not need to go into that. Mr. Breslin had to get some expertise in to tease out what was going on and get a professional evaluation done. Consultants brought in by the HSE or the Department to do that. The idea of this hospital was that it was to be tri-located and the maternity hospital was critically important in terms of the location. That will be all the more challenging now...

Public Accounts Committee: National Paediatric Hospital Development Board: Financial Statements 2017 (Resumed) (16 May 2019)

Catherine Murphy: The two-stage process or a separate board to develop it.

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