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Public Accounts Committee: Financial Statements 2016: Higher Education Authority, University College Cork and Cork Institute of Technology (24 May 2018)

Seán Fleming: It is not the final word?

Public Accounts Committee: Financial Statements 2016: Higher Education Authority, University College Cork and Cork Institute of Technology (24 May 2018)

Seán Fleming: Can we ask the Comptroller and Auditor General?

Public Accounts Committee: Financial Statements 2016: Higher Education Authority, University College Cork and Cork Institute of Technology (24 May 2018)

Seán Fleming: Can someone here make a phone call back to CIT and ask for it to be emailed to the committee secretariat? What is the most convenient way to do this before lunchtime?

Public Accounts Committee: Financial Statements 2016: Higher Education Authority, University College Cork and Cork Institute of Technology (24 May 2018)

Seán Fleming: It is in CIT's interest to try to conclude this matter here today in public session. That is all I would say.

Public Accounts Committee: Financial Statements 2016: Higher Education Authority, University College Cork and Cork Institute of Technology (24 May 2018)

Seán Fleming: If we go away with it-----

Public Accounts Committee: Financial Statements 2016: Higher Education Authority, University College Cork and Cork Institute of Technology (24 May 2018)

Seán Fleming: It is in CIT's interest not to leave it hanging.

Public Accounts Committee: Financial Statements 2016: Higher Education Authority, University College Cork and Cork Institute of Technology (24 May 2018)

Seán Fleming: It is 83 seconds.

Public Accounts Committee: Financial Statements 2016: Higher Education Authority, University College Cork and Cork Institute of Technology (24 May 2018)

Seán Fleming: The Deputy is well over time.

Public Accounts Committee: Financial Statements 2016: Higher Education Authority, University College Cork and Cork Institute of Technology (24 May 2018)

Seán Fleming: We will come back to Deputy Alan Kelly, if we have time. Before Deputy David Cullinane begins, I have one quick follow-through question about CIT. The witnesses said that as the board lacked the financial competence to support the finance committee, a sub-committee of the board, an outsider had to be brought in. Is that right?

Public Accounts Committee: Financial Statements 2016: Higher Education Authority, University College Cork and Cork Institute of Technology (24 May 2018)

Seán Fleming: The finance committee.

Public Accounts Committee: Financial Statements 2016: Higher Education Authority, University College Cork and Cork Institute of Technology (24 May 2018)

Seán Fleming: I am going to make a comment on behalf of the Committee of Public Accounts. We are speaking specifically about CIT which has a turnover of €100 million per annum, but my comment applies to the third level sector generally. In the context of corporate governance, it is shocking that we have boards and governing bodies in place in the sector that do not have financial competence. That...

Public Accounts Committee: Financial Statements 2016: Higher Education Authority, University College Cork and Cork Institute of Technology (24 May 2018)

Seán Fleming: I understand, but the audit committee does not sign the annual financial statements on behalf of the organisation. Who is going to sign the financial statements for last year on behalf of the board?

Public Accounts Committee: Financial Statements 2016: Higher Education Authority, University College Cork and Cork Institute of Technology (24 May 2018)

Seán Fleming: Who is the chairman of the governing body?

Public Accounts Committee: Financial Statements 2016: Higher Education Authority, University College Cork and Cork Institute of Technology (24 May 2018)

Seán Fleming: Does either Mr. O'Connor or Mr. Savage have a financial background?

Public Accounts Committee: Financial Statements 2016: Higher Education Authority, University College Cork and Cork Institute of Technology (24 May 2018)

Seán Fleming: I am not taking from it or Mr. O'Connor's ability. I am just saying the committee is being presented with accounts from an organisation which have been signed by people who do not have the skill set that allows them to do so. The committee will have to examine further the issue of the skills matrix on boards. I am not referring to the skills available to the finance committees or other...

Public Accounts Committee: Financial Statements 2016: Higher Education Authority, University College Cork and Cork Institute of Technology (24 May 2018)

Seán Fleming: I take that point. The accounts are audited and I am not saying there is an issue with them. I am just saying that, from the committee's point of view, in the context of the financial governance of any organisation, it is important to ensure the skills mix on boards includes financial expertise, notwithstanding the fact that an organisation might be educational. Does Mr. O'Connor...

Public Accounts Committee: Financial Statements 2016: Higher Education Authority, University College Cork and Cork Institute of Technology (24 May 2018)

Seán Fleming: I am not suggesting there is anything wrong with the accounts which have been audited. I am referring to the board which should not be relying on others to tell it that everything is okay.

Public Accounts Committee: Financial Statements 2016: Higher Education Authority, University College Cork and Cork Institute of Technology (24 May 2018)

Seán Fleming: Does Mr. Love wish to comment?

Public Accounts Committee: Financial Statements 2016: Higher Education Authority, University College Cork and Cork Institute of Technology (24 May 2018)

Seán Fleming: We will park that issue for now, but we will come back to the broad issue when we review today's meeting in due course.

Public Accounts Committee: Financial Statements 2016: Higher Education Authority, University College Cork and Cork Institute of Technology (24 May 2018)

Seán Fleming: This is the Deputy's last question for the first round.

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