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Public Accounts Committee: 2017 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 29 - Department of Communications, Climate Action and Environment
Chapter 8 - Measures relating to Cyber Security
Chapter 9 - Energy Efficiency National Fund
(6 Dec 2018)

David Cullinane: I do not believe everything I read in the newspapers, but that is the reason the witnesses are here to put the stories to the test to see if they are true. On 9 November, The Irish Times quotes the overall cost of the national broadband plan as being somewhere between €1.5 billion and €3 billion. Mr. Griffin is not going to respond to that. It stated the uptake for Eir's...

Public Accounts Committee: 2017 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 29 - Department of Communications, Climate Action and Environment
Chapter 8 - Measures relating to Cyber Security
Chapter 9 - Energy Efficiency National Fund
(6 Dec 2018)

David Cullinane: What is the figure?

Public Accounts Committee: 2017 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 29 - Department of Communications, Climate Action and Environment
Chapter 8 - Measures relating to Cyber Security
Chapter 9 - Energy Efficiency National Fund
(6 Dec 2018)

David Cullinane: Is it about 20%.

Public Accounts Committee: 2017 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 29 - Department of Communications, Climate Action and Environment
Chapter 8 - Measures relating to Cyber Security
Chapter 9 - Energy Efficiency National Fund
(6 Dec 2018)

David Cullinane: As the target is 20% for Eir's fibre to the home initiative, what is the uptake target in the national broadband plan?

Public Accounts Committee: 2017 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 29 - Department of Communications, Climate Action and Environment
Chapter 8 - Measures relating to Cyber Security
Chapter 9 - Energy Efficiency National Fund
(6 Dec 2018)

David Cullinane: Yes. I am not saying that target is real. Based on the 20% uptake, which seems quite low, what are the uptake targets in the national broadband plan? Earlier there was a conversation on total cost, the uptake and how much broadband would cost per household. What uptake target is envisaged by the Department?

Public Accounts Committee: 2017 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 29 - Department of Communications, Climate Action and Environment
Chapter 8 - Measures relating to Cyber Security
Chapter 9 - Energy Efficiency National Fund
(6 Dec 2018)

David Cullinane: I thank the witnesses for their responses. I appreciate the reasons Mr. Griffin cannot give us all of the information that we seek. We all appreciate that. This discussion has been a useful exercise. I thank him for giving a commitment to come back here again and, hopefully, he will be in a position to give us more information. I want to now ask questions about RTÉ. I am not sure...

Public Accounts Committee: 2017 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 29 - Department of Communications, Climate Action and Environment
Chapter 8 - Measures relating to Cyber Security
Chapter 9 - Energy Efficiency National Fund
(6 Dec 2018)

David Cullinane: We had the pleasure of RTÉ's company as well.

Public Accounts Committee: 2017 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 29 - Department of Communications, Climate Action and Environment
Chapter 8 - Measures relating to Cyber Security
Chapter 9 - Energy Efficiency National Fund
(6 Dec 2018)

David Cullinane: We got responses from them. Earlier questions were asked about RTÉ and Spectrum.

Public Accounts Committee: 2017 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 29 - Department of Communications, Climate Action and Environment
Chapter 8 - Measures relating to Cyber Security
Chapter 9 - Energy Efficiency National Fund
(6 Dec 2018)

David Cullinane: Was the cost €8 million?

Public Accounts Committee: 2017 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 29 - Department of Communications, Climate Action and Environment
Chapter 8 - Measures relating to Cyber Security
Chapter 9 - Energy Efficiency National Fund
(6 Dec 2018)

David Cullinane: I did not hear the answer as I had to step outside of the meeting room to take a call.

Public Accounts Committee: 2017 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 29 - Department of Communications, Climate Action and Environment
Chapter 8 - Measures relating to Cyber Security
Chapter 9 - Energy Efficiency National Fund
(6 Dec 2018)

David Cullinane: Very good. The Department does not have a service level agreement with RTÉ but it has something else.

Public Accounts Committee: 2017 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 29 - Department of Communications, Climate Action and Environment
Chapter 8 - Measures relating to Cyber Security
Chapter 9 - Energy Efficiency National Fund
(6 Dec 2018)

David Cullinane: What is it called?

Public Accounts Committee: 2017 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 29 - Department of Communications, Climate Action and Environment
Chapter 8 - Measures relating to Cyber Security
Chapter 9 - Energy Efficiency National Fund
(6 Dec 2018)

David Cullinane: Can we record that as a win for the Committee of Public Accounts?

Public Accounts Committee: 2017 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 29 - Department of Communications, Climate Action and Environment
Chapter 8 - Measures relating to Cyber Security
Chapter 9 - Energy Efficiency National Fund
(6 Dec 2018)

David Cullinane: We do not get too many.

Public Accounts Committee: 2017 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 29 - Department of Communications, Climate Action and Environment
Chapter 8 - Measures relating to Cyber Security
Chapter 9 - Energy Efficiency National Fund
(6 Dec 2018)

David Cullinane: RTÉ would want to provide that.

Public Accounts Committee: 2017 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 29 - Department of Communications, Climate Action and Environment
Chapter 8 - Measures relating to Cyber Security
Chapter 9 - Energy Efficiency National Fund
(6 Dec 2018)

David Cullinane: I want to ask a question on an issue that we have queried with RTÉ. We dealt with the matter when we discussed correspondence this morning before the witnesses were invited in to the meeting. I refer to the Eversheds report on the possibility of bogus self-employment practices within RTÉ and the fact that 128 contracts have been reviewed. Is the Secretary General aware of the matter?

Public Accounts Committee: 2017 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 29 - Department of Communications, Climate Action and Environment
Chapter 8 - Measures relating to Cyber Security
Chapter 9 - Energy Efficiency National Fund
(6 Dec 2018)

David Cullinane: I raised the matter because RTÉ receives about 45% of its funding from the Department.

Public Accounts Committee: 2017 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 29 - Department of Communications, Climate Action and Environment
Chapter 8 - Measures relating to Cyber Security
Chapter 9 - Energy Efficiency National Fund
(6 Dec 2018)

David Cullinane: We had the Secretary General of the Department of Social Protection before the committee and he, helpfully, reminded me that bogus self-employment is illegal. At what point did the Department of Communications, Climate Action and Environment or has the Department ever become aware about the potential for illegal or bogus self-employment contracts in RTÉ?

Public Accounts Committee: 2017 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 29 - Department of Communications, Climate Action and Environment
Chapter 8 - Measures relating to Cyber Security
Chapter 9 - Energy Efficiency National Fund
(6 Dec 2018)

David Cullinane: When one has either service level or oversight agreements in place then one must make sure that there is a level of oversight above the organisation, and in this case, it is RTÉ. Given that we had a report, which identified that there may be a problem, and given that we know that it is illegal to operate bogus self-employment, there would be an obligation on Accounting Officers and...

Public Accounts Committee: 2017 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 29 - Department of Communications, Climate Action and Environment
Chapter 8 - Measures relating to Cyber Security
Chapter 9 - Energy Efficiency National Fund
(6 Dec 2018)

David Cullinane: Why not? I was taken to task by the Secretary General of the other Department who said that it was illegal, and if any official was aware of bogus self-employment then he or she would be obliged to report as it is an illegal practice.

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