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Ceisteanna ar Pholasaí nó ar Reachtaíocht - Questions on Policy or Legislation (15 Nov 2023)

John McGuinness: A number of medical card holders have complained to me and have expressed concern about medicines, which they will be taking for life, being unavailable in their chemist. I understand there is an issue around that. I ask the Taoiseach to clarify that for me. There is evidence that some medicines dealing with HRT right up through to asthma are being shared on social media or people are...

Electoral (Amendment) Bill 2023: Second Stage (14 Nov 2023)

John McGuinness: Democracy is all we have and the best model in operation is the one we have. Whether we like it, political parties have derailed democracy to a degree. They have taken charge of it. What we have now is a directed democracy. Parliamentary parties of one kind or another in the House - I can certainly speak for my own – tend to put a straitjacket on each of the Members to ensure there...

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Budget 2024 Expenditure Ceiling and Resource Allocation for the Department of Health and HSE: Discussion (14 Nov 2023)

John McGuinness: Apologies have been received from Senator Higgins. In today's session the committee will examine the expenditure ceiling and resource allocation to the Department of Health and HSE in the context of budget 2024. We are joined by Mr. David Moloney, Secretary General, Department of Public Expenditure, National Development Plan Delivery and Reform; Mr. Eoin Dormer, principal officer, health...

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Budget 2024 Expenditure Ceiling and Resource Allocation for the Department of Health and HSE: Discussion (14 Nov 2023)

John McGuinness: I will have to interrupt the Deputy. There is a vote in the Chamber and we will have to suspend the meeting.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Budget 2024 Expenditure Ceiling and Resource Allocation for the Department of Health and HSE: Discussion (14 Nov 2023)

John McGuinness: Deputy Doherty may resume.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Budget 2024 Expenditure Ceiling and Resource Allocation for the Department of Health and HSE: Discussion (14 Nov 2023)

John McGuinness: Mr. Moloney's Department is the Department of Public Expenditure, National Development Plan Delivery and Reform. I have listened carefully to the conversation between the members and witnesses in response to the questions that were asked. I must say that it would not happen in the private sector. Some of the questions that were asked were reasonable questions and neither Mr. Moloney nor...

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Budget 2024 Expenditure Ceiling and Resource Allocation for the Department of Health and HSE: Discussion (14 Nov 2023)

John McGuinness: I do not want to get into this discussion again in the sense of hearing comments such as "I am not sure" and "It is an operational matter for them". Mr. Dormer is managing his Department and the funding that it allocates. He spends a lot of time with this budget oversight group. He should know whether the HSE has a fully integrated management system in place. Mr. Dormer tells me that it...

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Budget 2024 Expenditure Ceiling and Resource Allocation for the Department of Health and HSE: Discussion (14 Nov 2023)

John McGuinness: Can Mr. Dormer rely on it? Can the information the Department is getting from the manual systems across all sorts of areas within the HSE be relied on? How does the Department know the information is good?

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Budget 2024 Expenditure Ceiling and Resource Allocation for the Department of Health and HSE: Discussion (14 Nov 2023)

John McGuinness: I am asking Mr. Dormer because he is on the committee.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Budget 2024 Expenditure Ceiling and Resource Allocation for the Department of Health and HSE: Discussion (14 Nov 2023)

John McGuinness: But Mr. Dormer does not know whether it is accurate or not. It would seem to be inaccurate when we compare what Mr. Dormer seems to be getting monthly with what the outturns are and then what the shortfall is. If we go to the quarterly expenditure memos to the Government, what are they based on?

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Budget 2024 Expenditure Ceiling and Resource Allocation for the Department of Health and HSE: Discussion (14 Nov 2023)

John McGuinness: Is the accruals methodology then not really best practice in terms of accountancy as we know it in the private sector?

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Budget 2024 Expenditure Ceiling and Resource Allocation for the Department of Health and HSE: Discussion (14 Nov 2023)

John McGuinness: Is the Department of Public Expenditure, National Development Plan Delivery and Reform happy with that?

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Budget 2024 Expenditure Ceiling and Resource Allocation for the Department of Health and HSE: Discussion (14 Nov 2023)

John McGuinness: What did the Department do about it over the past 20 years to change it?

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Budget 2024 Expenditure Ceiling and Resource Allocation for the Department of Health and HSE: Discussion (14 Nov 2023)

John McGuinness: Let us take as an example Aldi, Lidl, Dunnes Stores or some other business that is represented all over the country, has a huge number of staff, has thousands of different products on its shelves and has different moneys coming in from different quarters and staff to control. How do they manage, but the Department of Public Expenditure, National Development Plan Delivery and Reform cannot?

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Budget 2024 Expenditure Ceiling and Resource Allocation for the Department of Health and HSE: Discussion (14 Nov 2023)

John McGuinness: When were the health boards abolished?

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Budget 2024 Expenditure Ceiling and Resource Allocation for the Department of Health and HSE: Discussion (14 Nov 2023)

John McGuinness: Yes. It was 2005. That was 18 years ago and the Department is still talking about them. This is shocking because it oversees reform.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Budget 2024 Expenditure Ceiling and Resource Allocation for the Department of Health and HSE: Discussion (14 Nov 2023)

John McGuinness: Mr. Moloney thinks.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Budget 2024 Expenditure Ceiling and Resource Allocation for the Department of Health and HSE: Discussion (14 Nov 2023)

John McGuinness: Is that commitment coming from the Department by way of demanding better accountability from the HSE or is it coming from the HSE or the Department of Health? Who is more concerned? Why are we in this every single year? It has been like this every single year for 25 years.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Budget 2024 Expenditure Ceiling and Resource Allocation for the Department of Health and HSE: Discussion (14 Nov 2023)

John McGuinness: Twenty-five years ago, an issue was raised at the Committee of Public Accounts. It was all about a technology system that would report on everything to do with the management of the health boards, the HSE or whatever it was. There must be systems available in the commercial world that can manage big business operations, stocks, staff, you name it. Yet, the officials do not know how many...

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