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Public Accounts Committee: Financial Statements 2024: Health Service Executive (16 Oct 2025)

Séamus McGrath: They will have to move faster here now as well. I appreciate that.

Public Accounts Committee: Financial Statements 2024: Health Service Executive (16 Oct 2025)

Séamus McGrath: I thank the witnesses. Going back to the children's hospital and the integration of CHI into the HSE, this is progressing and is welcome. Deputy Ardagh touched on the matter earlier. The further extension of the substantial completion date to the end of November is very serious. Does that have implications? We were given a date of June 2026 for the start of treatments and so on at the...

Public Accounts Committee: Financial Statements 2024: Health Service Executive (16 Oct 2025)

Séamus McGrath: I thank Mr. Gloster. Moving on to the use of external consultants by the HSE, it has been reported that €250 million was spent over a two-year period in relation to external consultants. Just be clear, these are not medical consultants these are management consultants. The figure seems very high.

Public Accounts Committee: Financial Statements 2024: Health Service Executive (16 Oct 2025)

Séamus McGrath: As chief executive, is Mr. Gloster putting in place a plan to reduce dependency on external consultants? Do we expect that in 2026, for example, that we will be spending similar amounts of money on external consultants? Is there a plan to reduce the HSE's reliance on external consultants?

Public Accounts Committee: Financial Statements 2024: Health Service Executive (16 Oct 2025)

Séamus McGrath: That is about €125 million per year. Do the witnesses see that figure coming down substantially in the coming years?

Public Accounts Committee: Financial Statements 2024: Health Service Executive (16 Oct 2025)

Séamus McGrath: I might come in again, but my final word now is to wish Mr. Gloster well.

Public Accounts Committee: Financial Statements 2024: Health Service Executive (16 Oct 2025)

Séamus McGrath: I know you are going to leave the organisation in a few months' time. Overall, I think you have had a very good tenure as chief executive. I wish you well.

Public Accounts Committee: Financial Statements 2024: Health Service Executive (16 Oct 2025)

Séamus McGrath: I want to return to the issue of insourcing. The chief executive outlined it was his belief that a certain part of it should be discontinued. What is the update on its discontinuation?

Public Accounts Committee: Financial Statements 2024: Health Service Executive (16 Oct 2025)

Séamus McGrath: The same individuals working in the public hospital were then-----

Public Accounts Committee: Financial Statements 2024: Health Service Executive (16 Oct 2025)

Séamus McGrath: But in the same building.

Public Accounts Committee: Financial Statements 2024: Health Service Executive (16 Oct 2025)

Séamus McGrath: Using the same facilities.

Public Accounts Committee: Financial Statements 2024: Health Service Executive (16 Oct 2025)

Séamus McGrath: Mr. Gloster said it was a disincentive for them-----

Public Accounts Committee: Financial Statements 2024: Health Service Executive (16 Oct 2025)

Séamus McGrath: A perverse incentive.

Public Accounts Committee: Financial Statements 2024: Health Service Executive (16 Oct 2025)

Séamus McGrath: To ask a straight question, does Mr. Gloster believe there was wrongdoing in some of the activities that went on in the insourcing?

Public Accounts Committee: Financial Statements 2024: Health Service Executive (16 Oct 2025)

Séamus McGrath: A conflict of interest.

Public Accounts Committee: Financial Statements 2024: Health Service Executive (16 Oct 2025)

Séamus McGrath: But Mr. Gloster does not see anything criminal or anything like that.

Public Accounts Committee: Financial Statements 2024: Health Service Executive (16 Oct 2025)

Séamus McGrath: I need to move on, if that is okay, and I thank Mr. Gloster. Rightly or wrongly, there is a perception of the HSE being top-heavy in management. In terms of salaries, I know from newspaper articles that more than ten people were paid more than €500,000. I suspect they are consultants and clinical people. What is the overall figure for non-clinical and non-health professionals...

Public Accounts Committee: Financial Statements 2024: Health Service Executive (16 Oct 2025)

Séamus McGrath: I understand that.

Public Accounts Committee: Financial Statements 2024: Health Service Executive (16 Oct 2025)

Séamus McGrath: I understand that.

Public Accounts Committee: Financial Statements 2024: Health Service Executive (16 Oct 2025)

Séamus McGrath: Does Mr. Gloster believe there is still scope to reduce management levels in the organisation?

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