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Public Accounts Committee: 2017 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 24 - Justice and Equality
(4 Apr 2019)

David Cullinane: I would like to follow on from that by asking about the note that was provided in respect of the length of time people spend in reception centres. Approximately 10.5% of people in reception centres have been there for between four and seven years. This is quite a high figure. If it is the case that the asylum processes are getting faster - if applications are being processed more quickly -...

Public Accounts Committee: 2017 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 24 - Justice and Equality
(4 Apr 2019)

David Cullinane: Yes. Why are people in the system for between four and seven years?

Public Accounts Committee: 2017 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 24 - Justice and Equality
(4 Apr 2019)

David Cullinane: Can I ask-----

Public Accounts Committee: 2017 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 24 - Justice and Equality
(4 Apr 2019)

David Cullinane: Okay.

Public Accounts Committee: 2017 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 24 - Justice and Equality
(4 Apr 2019)

David Cullinane: Okay. Almost 30% of people have been waiting for between two years and seven years, which again is quite high.

Public Accounts Committee: 2017 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 24 - Justice and Equality
(4 Apr 2019)

David Cullinane: At local authority level, weekly meetings take place to look at all the cases in which people have ended up in emergency accommodation or been classed as homeless. What work is done by the Department on a weekly basis with regard to the 10.5% cohort or the 20% cohort I have mentioned? I understand that in some cases, there may be judicial reviews or there may be other issues. Are the cases...

Public Accounts Committee: 2017 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 24 - Justice and Equality
(4 Apr 2019)

David Cullinane: Would Mr. O'Driscoll have data regarding what percentage of the 10.5% remain in direct provision because they are awaiting judicial review? I am not asking him to give us names of individuals but to furnish the committee with a breakdown of the status of the people within that 10.5% figure. It would assist us in identifying if it is the case that people are awaiting the court process and,...

Public Accounts Committee: 2017 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 24 - Justice and Equality
(4 Apr 2019)

David Cullinane: It is stated in the information already provided and in a report in The Irish Timesthat there are over 500 asylum seekers living in hotels and bed and breakfast accommodation. This issue may have been raised earlier. According to this media report, there were 196 asylum seekers in emergency accommodation in November of last year. By February of this year, that number had increased to 329...

Public Accounts Committee: 2017 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 24 - Justice and Equality
(4 Apr 2019)

David Cullinane: According to the information provided, the cost of that provision is €4.5 million per annum. Is that correct?

Public Accounts Committee: 2017 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 24 - Justice and Equality
(4 Apr 2019)

David Cullinane: It is very expensive.

Public Accounts Committee: 2017 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 24 - Justice and Equality
(4 Apr 2019)

David Cullinane: Would it not be more cost effective if we were dealing with them directly rather than in emergency accommodation?

Public Accounts Committee: 2017 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 24 - Justice and Equality
(4 Apr 2019)

David Cullinane: I understand that. The answer is to build new accommodation centres. I know there were difficulties in some areas around opening centres, which Deputy MacSharry went through earlier, and maybe some other speakers did as well. Some were due to open and there were fire problems and other issues. Is there a difficulty with opening reception centres in areas? Is it the case that the...

Public Accounts Committee: 2017 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 24 - Justice and Equality
(4 Apr 2019)

David Cullinane: It is Mr. O'Driscoll's job to ensure there is accommodation.

Public Accounts Committee: 2017 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 24 - Justice and Equality
(4 Apr 2019)

David Cullinane: It is also his job to make sure we have a sufficient number of reception centres and accommodation premises for people. Good planning would ensure that is the case. If we end up in the position where we have a rapid increase in emergency accommodation, that is down to either bad planning or some other reason. I am trying to establish the reason for it. In simple terms, what is the reason...

Public Accounts Committee: 2017 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 24 - Justice and Equality
(4 Apr 2019)

David Cullinane: I do not like to interrupt when Mr. O'Driscoll is responding to my questions but if there has been a massive increase in demand then he has to prove that that is the case. Can he provide us with the data which point to where in recent times there has been an unexpected increase in demand such that the Department has not been in a position to meet people's needs?

Public Accounts Committee: 2017 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 24 - Justice and Equality
(4 Apr 2019)

David Cullinane: I am speaking about an increase above where the number would have been for the previous six months, 12 months or two years.

Public Accounts Committee: 2017 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 24 - Justice and Equality
(4 Apr 2019)

David Cullinane: The question Mr. O'Driscoll has not answered is why there is difficulty in finding new premises. If he cannot answer the question now, he can forward a detailed note on it to the committee.

Public Accounts Committee: 2017 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 24 - Justice and Equality
(4 Apr 2019)

David Cullinane: Mr. O'Driscoll's initial response to my question regarding the 526 people who are homeless was not that there was an increase in demand but that we do not have the accommodation for them.

Public Accounts Committee: 2017 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 24 - Justice and Equality
(4 Apr 2019)

David Cullinane: The internal audit of any Department or organisation is important for the Committee of Public Accounts because internal audit can examine issues where there might be wrongdoing or a lapse in procedures, governance and so on. I am aware that the Department carried out an investigation into claims that almost €90,000 in funding was misused by a non-government body working in the sexual...

Public Accounts Committee: 2017 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 24 - Justice and Equality
(4 Apr 2019)

David Cullinane: Can the committee get a copy of the audit report?

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