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Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Dual Pricing for Insurance: Discussion (Resumed) (21 Nov 2019)

Pearse Doherty: I am seeking clarity on this point. Is Insurance Ireland telling the committee that the average premium for an insured vehicle in the State decreased in 2017?

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Dual Pricing for Insurance: Discussion (Resumed) (21 Nov 2019)

Pearse Doherty: Insurance Ireland cannot tell us about individual figures but the organisation has the average across the industry.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Dual Pricing for Insurance: Discussion (Resumed) (21 Nov 2019)

Pearse Doherty: Insurance Ireland has completely disputed that. It has disputed it with the Department of Finance in the context of the motor insurance group. It has suggested that the CSO collection of data is wrong. We all know that it uses only one subset of insurance. In any event, Insurance Ireland provides data to its European colleagues for the reporting they do across the motor insurance...

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Dual Pricing for Insurance: Discussion (Resumed) (21 Nov 2019)

Pearse Doherty: I agree on that point. We agree in terms of the-----

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Dual Pricing for Insurance: Discussion (Resumed) (21 Nov 2019)

Pearse Doherty: I made the point — Mr. Horan does not dispute it — that the award level has actually been dropping over recent years.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Dual Pricing for Insurance: Discussion (Resumed) (21 Nov 2019)

Pearse Doherty: What is the cost of claim ratio now in the motor insurance sector in Ireland? Is there a figure for 2018?

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Dual Pricing for Insurance: Discussion (Resumed) (21 Nov 2019)

Pearse Doherty: Mr. Horan should just stick to 2018.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Dual Pricing for Insurance: Discussion (Resumed) (21 Nov 2019)

Pearse Doherty: It is 71%. Was the average in the European Union 75%?

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Dual Pricing for Insurance: Discussion (Resumed) (21 Nov 2019)

Pearse Doherty: We had representatives of a number of insurance companies in. Is the delegation talking about figures for 2017 or 2018?

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Dual Pricing for Insurance: Discussion (Resumed) (21 Nov 2019)

Pearse Doherty: We had representatives of a number of insurance companies, including AXA and Aviva, before us and I asked them all the questions about the claims ratio. They are saying the claims ratio is now 65%, which means that for every euro taken in, 65 cent is paid out in claims. It is a good indicator in respect of claims. The other part will be made up of either the industry's profits, which have...

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Dual Pricing for Insurance: Discussion (Resumed) (21 Nov 2019)

Pearse Doherty: Maybe if the insurance sector were not working as a cartel and if it were not engaging in price signalling, and if there were not a failure to share data with European competitors, in respect of which there are two investigations-----

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Dual Pricing for Insurance: Discussion (Resumed) (21 Nov 2019)

Pearse Doherty: -----we would have more competition in the industry.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Dual Pricing for Insurance: Discussion (Resumed) (21 Nov 2019)

Pearse Doherty: Are there two investigations?

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Dual Pricing for Insurance: Discussion (Resumed) (21 Nov 2019)

Pearse Doherty: Is one on price signalling, which would be-----

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Dual Pricing for Insurance: Discussion (Resumed) (21 Nov 2019)

Pearse Doherty: Is the other investigation on access to data by competitors that might want to enter the market? Is that what needs to be proven, or not?

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Dual Pricing for Insurance: Discussion (Resumed) (21 Nov 2019)

Pearse Doherty: Yes. That implies access to data that competitors would need to gain access to the market.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Dual Pricing for Insurance: Discussion (Resumed) (21 Nov 2019)

Pearse Doherty: Does Mr. Hassett accept that dual pricing exists in the Irish insurance industry?

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Dual Pricing for Insurance: Discussion (Resumed) (21 Nov 2019)

Pearse Doherty: I will come back with a second round on dual pricing.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Dual Pricing for Insurance: Discussion (Resumed) (21 Nov 2019)

Pearse Doherty: Why is Insurance Ireland quoting gross incurred claims instead of net incurred claims?

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Dual Pricing for Insurance: Discussion (Resumed) (21 Nov 2019)

Pearse Doherty: In relation to awards, net incurred claims is the issue that we should be dealing with.

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