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Public Accounts Committee: 2020 Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 29 - Environment, Climate and Communications
National Broadband Plan Expenditure and Related Matters
(10 Feb 2022)

Brian Stanley: Where did the €32.5 million come from?

Public Accounts Committee: 2020 Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 29 - Environment, Climate and Communications
National Broadband Plan Expenditure and Related Matters
(10 Feb 2022)

Brian Stanley: A State subsidy.

Public Accounts Committee: 2020 Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 29 - Environment, Climate and Communications
National Broadband Plan Expenditure and Related Matters
(10 Feb 2022)

Brian Stanley: Am I correct in saying that Mr. McCourt got in the region of €33 million for securing the contract and doing the preparation work?

Public Accounts Committee: 2020 Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 29 - Environment, Climate and Communications
National Broadband Plan Expenditure and Related Matters
(10 Feb 2022)

Brian Stanley: It would be unusual for a company to pay out in excess of €32 million - the figure I calculated was closer to €38 million but let it be €32.5 million - to investors in a year in which the company made a loss of more than double that figure. That would be unusual in a company.

Public Accounts Committee: 2020 Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 29 - Environment, Climate and Communications
National Broadband Plan Expenditure and Related Matters
(10 Feb 2022)

Brian Stanley: I got that.

Public Accounts Committee: 2020 Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 29 - Environment, Climate and Communications
National Broadband Plan Expenditure and Related Matters
(10 Feb 2022)

Brian Stanley: NBI had no customer income that year.

Public Accounts Committee: 2020 Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 29 - Environment, Climate and Communications
National Broadband Plan Expenditure and Related Matters
(10 Feb 2022)

Brian Stanley: What would "very small" mean?

Public Accounts Committee: 2020 Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 29 - Environment, Climate and Communications
National Broadband Plan Expenditure and Related Matters
(10 Feb 2022)

Brian Stanley: Less than €100,000. There was €32.5 million paid out to investors. The income from customers was less than €100,000 and the company was running at a loss of €70 million in the same year.

Public Accounts Committee: 2020 Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 29 - Environment, Climate and Communications
National Broadband Plan Expenditure and Related Matters
(10 Feb 2022)

Brian Stanley: I am sorry; we are going by the figures quoted here. That is a summation of what Mr. Kelly has just told me.

Public Accounts Committee: 2020 Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 29 - Environment, Climate and Communications
National Broadband Plan Expenditure and Related Matters
(10 Feb 2022)

Brian Stanley: Were the members of the board concerned?

Public Accounts Committee: 2020 Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 29 - Environment, Climate and Communications
National Broadband Plan Expenditure and Related Matters
(10 Feb 2022)

Brian Stanley: No concerns. Okay.

Public Accounts Committee: 2020 Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 29 - Environment, Climate and Communications
National Broadband Plan Expenditure and Related Matters
(10 Feb 2022)

Brian Stanley: The company made a loss of €70 million in 2020. The revenue it brought in from customers was less than €100,000 and it paid out €32.5 million to investors. Those three figures are accurate.

Public Accounts Committee: 2020 Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 29 - Environment, Climate and Communications
National Broadband Plan Expenditure and Related Matters
(10 Feb 2022)

Brian Stanley: I got that.

Public Accounts Committee: 2020 Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 29 - Environment, Climate and Communications
National Broadband Plan Expenditure and Related Matters
(10 Feb 2022)

Brian Stanley: I want to ask Mr. Kelly about the interest rates. He said that 12% is not unusual. It is very high. When this scheme was being devised, loans were being offered at interest rates of 0.25% and 0.5% by the European Investment Bank, EIB, and other sources, and here the State is tied into a contract where 12% interest is being paid out. That is highly unusual. It does not sit right with me...

Public Accounts Committee: 2020 Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 29 - Environment, Climate and Communications
National Broadband Plan Expenditure and Related Matters
(10 Feb 2022)

Brian Stanley: Okay. I take it that is unsecured. In reality, the State has ponied up for between €2.6 billion and €2.7 billion. We know that. I do not have time to go into it now but previous questions and commitments regarding milestones turned out to be very different in terms of penalties. Assurances other Deputies and I got on the floor of the Dáil got in 2018 and 2019 were...

Public Accounts Committee: 2020 Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 29 - Environment, Climate and Communications
National Broadband Plan Expenditure and Related Matters
(10 Feb 2022)

Brian Stanley: It is a healthy investment.

Public Accounts Committee: 2020 Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 29 - Environment, Climate and Communications
National Broadband Plan Expenditure and Related Matters
(10 Feb 2022)

Brian Stanley: I get that.

Public Accounts Committee: 2020 Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 29 - Environment, Climate and Communications
National Broadband Plan Expenditure and Related Matters
(10 Feb 2022)

Brian Stanley: It is a healthy return on an investment.

Public Accounts Committee: 2020 Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 29 - Environment, Climate and Communications
National Broadband Plan Expenditure and Related Matters
(10 Feb 2022)

Brian Stanley: It is a healthy return for all those investors who have joined it now-----

Public Accounts Committee: 2020 Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 29 - Environment, Climate and Communications
National Broadband Plan Expenditure and Related Matters
(10 Feb 2022)

Brian Stanley: -----at 12% compound interest rate on a project that is underwritten by the State. Those are the facts of it.

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