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Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Rising Cost of Motor Insurance: Discussion (Resumed) (15 Sep 2016)

John McGuinness: Yes, but outside of that they do not have it.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Rising Cost of Motor Insurance: Discussion (Resumed) (15 Sep 2016)

John McGuinness: Does the fact that the Irish Brokers' Association is an associate member limit it to the range of data that is available through its associate membership?

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Rising Cost of Motor Insurance: Discussion (Resumed) (15 Sep 2016)

John McGuinness: The data to which the association does have access informs companies from outside of Ireland that engage with it what the market is like.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Rising Cost of Motor Insurance: Discussion (Resumed) (15 Sep 2016)

John McGuinness: In respect of a company from outside of the country that avails of the service of the Irish Brokers Association, the association has access to data that insurance companies from outside of Ireland who do not avail of its services do not have.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Rising Cost of Motor Insurance: Discussion (Resumed) (15 Sep 2016)

John McGuinness: Therefore, in respect of a company coming into Ireland and availing of the association's services the association would be able to provide it with the data for Ireland and whether to come or not?

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Rising Cost of Motor Insurance: Discussion (Resumed) (15 Sep 2016)

John McGuinness: How much does associate membership cost?

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Rising Cost of Motor Insurance: Discussion (Resumed) (15 Sep 2016)

John McGuinness: That is fair enough. In the context of big insurance companies, €10,000 is very little.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Rising Cost of Motor Insurance: Discussion (Resumed) (15 Sep 2016)

John McGuinness: Knowing what Mr. Carty knows about the databases in terms of what information they contain, would be say people should contact him or-----

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Rising Cost of Motor Insurance: Discussion (Resumed) (15 Sep 2016)

John McGuinness: That is fine. I had to ask the question because the information informs us in terms of what questions to pose to other contributors later today.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Rising Cost of Motor Insurance: Discussion (Resumed) (15 Sep 2016)

John McGuinness: Does Mr. Phelan wish to comment?

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Rising Cost of Motor Insurance: Discussion (Resumed) (15 Sep 2016)

John McGuinness: Would Mr. Carty like to make a final comment?

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Rising Cost of Motor Insurance: Discussion (Resumed) (15 Sep 2016)

John McGuinness: I thank all of the witnesses for their contributions. The committee now will suspend until 2 p.m.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Rising Cost of Motor Insurance: Discussion (Resumed) (15 Sep 2016)

John McGuinness: I welcome Mr. Fergal O'Leary, Mr. Patrick Kenny and Ms Karen O'Leary from the Competition and Consumer Protection Commission. Ms O'Leary will make an opening statement of five minutes, which will be followed by questions. I wish to advise the witnesses that by virtue of section 17(2)(l) of the Defamation Act 2009, witnesses are protected by absolute privilege in respect of their evidence to...

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Rising Cost of Motor Insurance: Discussion (Resumed) (15 Sep 2016)

John McGuinness: For clarification, Ms O'Leary said the commission was very active in the insurance sector and that, as part of its work, the Competition Authority had undertaken a major study in 2005 which recommended greater disclosure of risk related data because a lack of data acted as a barrier to entry. That is exactly what we have heard since we started these hearings. Is it not anti-competitive to...

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Rising Cost of Motor Insurance: Discussion (Resumed) (15 Sep 2016)

John McGuinness: It is, therefore, something for legislators.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Rising Cost of Motor Insurance: Discussion (Resumed) (15 Sep 2016)

John McGuinness: The authority recommended it, however. Has there been any follow-up on the recommendation since 2005? Is the commission asking why it has not been implemented?

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Rising Cost of Motor Insurance: Discussion (Resumed) (15 Sep 2016)

John McGuinness: Finally, would the witnesses consider that the withholding of that information by Insurance Ireland, thus preventing an entrant access to the market, is anti-competitive?

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Rising Cost of Motor Insurance: Discussion (Resumed) (15 Sep 2016)

John McGuinness: Why has the commission not taken action since 2005?

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Rising Cost of Motor Insurance: Discussion (Resumed) (15 Sep 2016)

John McGuinness: Mr. Kenny should ask the insurance companies. They have been here over the past few days telling us that, without data, they have nothing. They do not understand the market because they do not have data on it. Everyone knows Insurance Ireland has that data. Ms Dorothea Dowling, who was here earlier, gave us slides and information that would show this is not news. It is a fact that they...

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Rising Cost of Motor Insurance: Discussion (Resumed) (15 Sep 2016)

John McGuinness: That is not the question. The question is whether the Competition and Consumer Protection Commission, CCPC, knew that there was little or no movement in the market and that companies were actually leaving it. As an authority, should the CCPC not have been proactive in alerting the legislators of this House to the difficulty, or should it not at least have brought in Insurance Ireland to ask...

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