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Public Accounts Committee: 2020 Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 34 - Housing, Local Government and Heritage
(17 Feb 2022)

Brian Stanley: Who is considering it?

Public Accounts Committee: 2020 Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 34 - Housing, Local Government and Heritage
(17 Feb 2022)

Brian Stanley: Okay. If any of the officials are working on the review with the Minister, I ask them to convey that message to him.

Public Accounts Committee: 2020 Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 34 - Housing, Local Government and Heritage
(17 Feb 2022)

Brian Stanley: It is an urgent piece of work that needs to be completed.

Public Accounts Committee: 2020 Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 34 - Housing, Local Government and Heritage
(17 Feb 2022)

Brian Stanley: I will ask briefly about public private partnerships, PPPs. I have a lot of questions about PPPs that we will not have time to get into. Our guests are handed a policy, as I said earlier, to try to deal with this. Take, for example, the PPP for O'Devaney Gardens. Am I correct in saying that the cost to the State to purchase each of those units is €403,000?

Public Accounts Committee: 2020 Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 34 - Housing, Local Government and Heritage
(17 Feb 2022)

Brian Stanley: This is on public land so there are no land costs. Am I correct that the cost to the State is €403,000 per unit?

Public Accounts Committee: 2020 Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 34 - Housing, Local Government and Heritage
(17 Feb 2022)

Brian Stanley: If members wish to come in for a quick question each, they have three minutes each.

Public Accounts Committee: 2020 Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 34 - Housing, Local Government and Heritage
(17 Feb 2022)

Brian Stanley: There is about an extra 1,000 in the HAP scheme. What about the reply to the other question?

Public Accounts Committee: 2020 Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 34 - Housing, Local Government and Heritage
(17 Feb 2022)

Brian Stanley: I thank Ms Stapleton. That is important in terms of quality but also to speed up the process.

Public Accounts Committee: 2020 Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 34 - Housing, Local Government and Heritage
(17 Feb 2022)

Brian Stanley: It is something we need to do. I will return to the supplements for a moment. The figure of 28% is on the basis of figures given. They are received, the Comptroller and Auditor General looks at them and you look at them. I understand that; that is what you are getting. However, I can tell you that people who are not paying top-ups are the exception, including for constituents who are...

Public Accounts Committee: 2020 Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 34 - Housing, Local Government and Heritage
(17 Feb 2022)

Brian Stanley: I accept that.

Public Accounts Committee: 2020 Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 34 - Housing, Local Government and Heritage
(17 Feb 2022)

Brian Stanley: It is a huge shift in spending away from State or local authority housing assets. Somebody else has the asset, and that is the point.

Public Accounts Committee: 2020 Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 34 - Housing, Local Government and Heritage
(17 Feb 2022)

Brian Stanley: I have a question about the occupancy of emergency accommodation. There was an example in Holybrook Park, Clontarf, where Dublin City Council leased a house from private interests for emergency accommodation. My understanding is that the council was boxed into a situation. A person owned the property next door and a situation arose whereby the council was not going to get one without the...

Public Accounts Committee: 2020 Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 34 - Housing, Local Government and Heritage
(17 Feb 2022)

Brian Stanley: Okay, you can refer back to me on that. Thank you.

Public Accounts Committee: 2020 Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 34 - Housing, Local Government and Heritage
(17 Feb 2022)

Brian Stanley: There is another point relating to private rented accommodation. It is costing €7,800 per unit. Then, as I mentioned, the tenant in most cases pays a differential rent and also pays the top-up. The real cost of the unit, therefore, is far in excess of €7,800. That is the cost to the State and I accept that is the accurate figure you are giving. However, that is the 2020...

Public Accounts Committee: 2020 Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 34 - Housing, Local Government and Heritage
(17 Feb 2022)

Brian Stanley: The Deputy's time is up.

Public Accounts Committee: 2020 Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 34 - Housing, Local Government and Heritage
(17 Feb 2022)

Brian Stanley: I think the quarter 3 figures were approximately 3,600.

Public Accounts Committee: 2020 Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 34 - Housing, Local Government and Heritage
(17 Feb 2022)

Brian Stanley: Deputy Devlin will join us. He is on other parliamentary duty. Deputy James O'Connor is due to join us. I have some questions. I will revert to rent subsidies. Broadly speaking, one has RAS, HAP and capital leasing. I am going by the Department's Estimates for 2022 on page 9 of the briefing note. Some €293 million is budgeted for capital leasing under subhead A11.

Public Accounts Committee: 2020 Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 34 - Housing, Local Government and Heritage
(17 Feb 2022)

Brian Stanley: There is €12 million for repair and lease. The previous year, there was €123 million on rent supplements, not from the Department of Housing, Local Government and Heritage, but from the Department of Social Protection. I assume that will be approximately the same amount because many people in emergency situations, such as victims of domestic violence, are on rent supplement....

Public Accounts Committee: 2020 Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 34 - Housing, Local Government and Heritage
(17 Feb 2022)

Brian Stanley: Does the Department expect to hit 5,000 new social housing-delivered builds, either by approved housing bodies or local authorities? Will it exceed 5,000?

Public Accounts Committee: 2020 Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 34 - Housing, Local Government and Heritage
(17 Feb 2022)

Brian Stanley: We will come in at approximately half of the target envisaged. I note that in the lockdown this time last year social housing projects were continued. There is one very close to my area and I spoke to one of the officials about it during the break. That continued and did not stop during the lockdown. Okay, Covid had an effect, but it did not close down social housing construction. We...

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