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Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform: Forthcoming ECOFIN Council: Minister for Finance (18 Jun 2014)

Michael Noonan: No; I am saying that-----

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform: Forthcoming ECOFIN Council: Minister for Finance (18 Jun 2014)

Michael Noonan: There is a "whether" about the timing.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform: Forthcoming ECOFIN Council: Minister for Finance (18 Jun 2014)

Michael Noonan: There is always a "whether" about timing. We will take advice on that. That is the position we are in. Things have improved enormously. The other thing that has changed dramatically is that we run the argument in Europe. When I started making the argument, I was a sole voice arguing that there should be bail-ins rather than bailouts. I said that in bailing in the assets of banks, senior...

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform: Forthcoming ECOFIN Council: Minister for Finance (18 Jun 2014)

Michael Noonan: -----subordinate bondholders. When we started on that in Europe, it was as a sole voice, but now it is part of the legislative underpinning of banking union. The argument has been won and the bailing in of senior bondholders is now part of the system that is envisaged. We will continue to negotiate and I hope we will make progress.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform: Forthcoming ECOFIN Council: Minister for Finance (18 Jun 2014)

Michael Noonan: Of course we will apply. What does the Deputy think we have been talking about for the last five minutes in reply to Deputy McGrath? Of course we will apply, but the timing is a question of the best approach.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform: Forthcoming ECOFIN Council: Minister for Finance (18 Jun 2014)

Michael Noonan: Currently, there is nobody to apply to, as the mechanism is not in place. The mechanism will be in place, according to the commitments we have and the process now being engaged in, by November.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform: Forthcoming ECOFIN Council: Minister for Finance (18 Jun 2014)

Michael Noonan: That is right.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform: Forthcoming ECOFIN Council: Minister for Finance (18 Jun 2014)

Michael Noonan: In negotiations such as this, it is sometimes better to line up the diplomatic support before one makes a hard application. Our intention is to apply, if not in November.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform: Forthcoming ECOFIN Council: Minister for Finance (18 Jun 2014)

Michael Noonan: The Deputy is falling into the same trap he has fallen into for the last three years on all issues. The way he presents his case and the bottom line of his policy is that he hopes the Government will fail. He is trying to build a movement on the grief and sacrifices of the people and it assists his political position if the Government fails. It is clear from what he is saying that he hopes...

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform: Forthcoming ECOFIN Council: Minister for Finance (18 Jun 2014)

Michael Noonan: Why is the Deputy always on the begrudgery agenda?

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform: Forthcoming ECOFIN Council: Minister for Finance (18 Jun 2014)

Michael Noonan: I have given absolutely full and frank answers to all the questions that have been asked here. I have given the Deputy full and frank answers. To all the parliamentary questions he has put down, he has received full and frank answers when the questions are in order. He should not complain here that he is not getting the service to which he is entitled when he puts down parliamentary...

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform: Forthcoming ECOFIN Council: Minister for Finance (18 Jun 2014)

Michael Noonan: I respect their views because they are experts in their field. They are ad idemwith what we said in the stability pact in April. They are probably working off the same data that were available to us then. Since then, however, there are pieces of evidence - ranging from hard fact to anecdotal - which would suggest that our position is improving as the year goes by. I am grateful to the...

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform: Forthcoming ECOFIN Council: Minister for Finance (18 Jun 2014)

Michael Noonan: In coming up with our estimate of what is required by 2018, we have worked on the best information we got from the Commission. The Irish Fiscal Advisory Council seems to be working from a different assumption. I would like my officials and those of the IFAC to see if they can reconcile the differences in approach. It comes back to my opening position that if the Irish Fiscal Advisory...

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform: Forthcoming ECOFIN Council: Minister for Finance (18 Jun 2014)

Michael Noonan: Yes. That is what we have spelled out in the medium-term economic strategy. The structural deficit is a difficult concept. The easiest thing is to ask what are the permanent features of the economy and what is cyclical. Whatever is cyclical rises and falls with the business cycle, so if one strips out what is cyclical the structural part is left. If there is a structural deficit the...

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform: Forthcoming ECOFIN Council: Minister for Finance (18 Jun 2014)

Michael Noonan: There is always briefing in Europe; it is the nature of it. There are 28 countries and officials from all the countries, including permanent representatives in Brussels from everywhere. There is constant briefing and re-briefing by practically everybody out there, so we should not get too excited by one briefing. As regards the recapitalisation of banks by an agency other than sovereign...

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform: Forthcoming ECOFIN Council: Minister for Finance (18 Jun 2014)

Michael Noonan: They are processed by ECOFIN; they are then advanced, as I stated, to the Council of Heads of State and Government and come back for final acceptance, subject to amendment by ECOFIN, at the July Council meeting. Normally, there is an engagement between the Commission and member states on how they will meet the recommendations, but there is a separate excessive deficit procedure. If there...

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform: Forthcoming ECOFIN Council: Minister for Finance (18 Jun 2014)

Michael Noonan: There is an excessive deficit procedure and a country specific recommendation every 12 months. There is a 12 month cycle and one would want to show progress. However, sometimes the specific excessive deficit procedure has to match the budgetary cycle of individual countries. If the budget is in accordance with the calendar year, there is not much point in taking corrective action the...

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform: Forthcoming ECOFIN Council: Minister for Finance (18 Jun 2014)

Michael Noonan: There is post-programme surveillance. Instead of one visit a year by the troika which would be common across all countries of the European Union, we have two. There is an additional visit - post-programme surveillance. The issues raised with us on the country specific recommendations flow, almost seamlessly, from the troika and the end of the bailout programme. They continue with issues...

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform: Forthcoming ECOFIN Council: Minister for Finance (18 Jun 2014)

Michael Noonan: That is it in a nutshell. We put forward our stability programme in April and the figure of €2 billion. At the time the best information at my disposal was that it would require an adjustment of €2 billion to get under the 3% deficit figure by 2015. There are a lot of moving parts as the year passes. I could not give an exact figure, but I am fairly confident in saying it...

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform: Forthcoming ECOFIN Council: Minister for Finance (18 Jun 2014)

Michael Noonan: Frequently, commentators confuse the target with the ways and means of achieving it. The target is to have a deficit figure below 3% in 2015, which will be the last budgetary adjustment. The ways and means of getting there involve an adjustment of €2 billion. That was the estimate when it was being planned on a multi-annual basis. That remained the best estimate when we published...

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