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Public Accounts Committee: HSE Report on Foster Home in Waterford Community Care Area: Discussion (2 Feb 2016)

Mary Lou McDonald: Hold on a second. All of that is in the documentation.

Public Accounts Committee: HSE Report on Foster Home in Waterford Community Care Area: Discussion (2 Feb 2016)

Mary Lou McDonald: I hope Mr. Healy is not deliberately missing my essential point, because his contention is that it fell to the family to make the call in respect of Ann's removal, albeit on a part-time basis, from this home. I am challenging Mr. Healy on that.

Public Accounts Committee: HSE Report on Foster Home in Waterford Community Care Area: Discussion (2 Feb 2016)

Mary Lou McDonald: I am challenging Mr. Healy on that because I actually do not accept it.

Public Accounts Committee: HSE Report on Foster Home in Waterford Community Care Area: Discussion (2 Feb 2016)

Mary Lou McDonald: I am sorry, Mr. Healy, but I am going to stop you right there. Not alone does Mr. O'Brien's initial statement emphasise the private nature of the arrangement in respect of Ann, but it goes on to reiterate that the family had confirmed that they had no concerns regarding the foster family or the level of care. Mr. Healy has already told Deputy Deasy that in his engagement with the family he...

Public Accounts Committee: HSE Report on Foster Home in Waterford Community Care Area: Discussion (2 Feb 2016)

Mary Lou McDonald: Do you know what I think you are doing, Mr. Healy? I think - if you do not mind - you are spoofing me.

Public Accounts Committee: HSE Report on Foster Home in Waterford Community Care Area: Discussion (2 Feb 2016)

Mary Lou McDonald: Let me tell you: I think you are spoofing. You are trying to bring us on a merry dance in respect of detail in reports that we cannot even see. Here is my proposition for the HSE and its predecessor organisation. I am putting it to it that it was its legal responsibility to ensure the safety of Ann. It carried that responsibility irrespective of the views of the family or the relationship...

Public Accounts Committee: HSE Report on Foster Home in Waterford Community Care Area: Discussion (2 Feb 2016)

Mary Lou McDonald: With whom did and does legal responsibility and onus rest in respect of the care and safety when a person with a severe intellectual disability who requires the care of the State turns 18? Where does it rest, Mr. O'Brien?

Public Accounts Committee: HSE Report on Foster Home in Waterford Community Care Area: Discussion (2 Feb 2016)

Mary Lou McDonald: I would like Mr. O'Brien to answer, please.

Public Accounts Committee: HSE Report on Foster Home in Waterford Community Care Area: Discussion (2 Feb 2016)

Mary Lou McDonald: With whom does the responsibility rest?

Public Accounts Committee: HSE Report on Foster Home in Waterford Community Care Area: Discussion (2 Feb 2016)

Mary Lou McDonald: As I see it, the onus and legal responsibility rested with the HSE. That is my understanding. I refer the delegates to the letter of apology. It is signed by Ms Colley. One of the matters for which there is an apology is an absence of the necessary protocols and arrangements to support the placement in foster families of vulnerable children and adults with a disability. The HSE concedes,...

Public Accounts Committee: HSE Report on Foster Home in Waterford Community Care Area: Discussion (2 Feb 2016)

Mary Lou McDonald: Mr. O'Brien said it in his opening statement.

Public Accounts Committee: HSE Report on Foster Home in Waterford Community Care Area: Discussion (2 Feb 2016)

Mary Lou McDonald: I thank Mr. Healy.

Public Accounts Committee: HSE Report on Foster Home in Waterford Community Care Area: Discussion (2 Feb 2016)

Mary Lou McDonald: Therein lies the difficulty. Please, there is no need for any further expansive narrative because here we go again; the onus was left on the family to make the call. That is a derogation of your duty. Irrespective of what the family thought, there was a responsibility on the State and on the authorities to protect this woman. She is a woman at this stage. She entered the care arrangement...

Public Accounts Committee: HSE Report on Foster Home in Waterford Community Care Area: Discussion (2 Feb 2016)

Mary Lou McDonald: Would Mr. O'Brien accept that it was not the responsibility of Ann's family to intervene in this matter and that ultimately the HSE and Mr. O'Brien's predecessor had the authority and the obligation to do that?

Public Accounts Committee: HSE Report on Foster Home in Waterford Community Care Area: Discussion (2 Feb 2016)

Mary Lou McDonald: Then what letter did Ann get?

Public Accounts Committee: HSE Report on Foster Home in Waterford Community Care Area: Discussion (2 Feb 2016)

Mary Lou McDonald: Yes. What is Mr. O'Brien's point? Is it his contention that in Ann's case there was not an absence of necessary protocols and arrangements to support her placement?

Public Accounts Committee: HSE Report on Foster Home in Waterford Community Care Area: Discussion (2 Feb 2016)

Mary Lou McDonald: Can we clarify that what Mr. O'Brien has conceded here he concedes in respect of all the persons concerned, including Ann?

Public Accounts Committee: HSE Report on Foster Home in Waterford Community Care Area: Discussion (2 Feb 2016)

Mary Lou McDonald: Has Mr. O'Brien legal advice to that effect?

Public Accounts Committee: HSE Report on Foster Home in Waterford Community Care Area: Discussion (2 Feb 2016)

Mary Lou McDonald: I would like to see that and I would query that very strongly.

Public Accounts Committee: HSE Report on Foster Home in Waterford Community Care Area: Discussion (2 Feb 2016)

Mary Lou McDonald: There is also a distinction in respect of the family concerned, and this is where the HSE has laid the emphasis, regarding a minor and regarding a person reaching the age of 18 and over. In that balance, it is very clear that Mr. O'Brien has tried to pass off Ann's case as being a flaw, a fault or a bad decision of her family. That is wrong and Mr. O'Brien is wrong to have presented it in...

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