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Public Accounts Committee: HSE Report on Foster Home in Waterford Community Care Area: Discussion (2 Feb 2016)

Mary Lou McDonald: I will come to that, if Mr. O'Brien does not mind.

Public Accounts Committee: HSE Report on Foster Home in Waterford Community Care Area: Discussion (2 Feb 2016)

Mary Lou McDonald: I will come to it. I just want to put the pieces of this together.

Public Accounts Committee: HSE Report on Foster Home in Waterford Community Care Area: Discussion (2 Feb 2016)

Mary Lou McDonald: That is what we have established so far. The child was placed in 1992 at 12 years of age on a part-time basis. The delegates from the HSE have no idea and cannot tell the committee what, if any, moneys were paid in respect of that child to what was still a foster home.

Public Accounts Committee: HSE Report on Foster Home in Waterford Community Care Area: Discussion (2 Feb 2016)

Mary Lou McDonald: Pardon?

Public Accounts Committee: HSE Report on Foster Home in Waterford Community Care Area: Discussion (2 Feb 2016)

Mary Lou McDonald: However, Mr. O'Brien cannot tell me that because he does not have records.

Public Accounts Committee: HSE Report on Foster Home in Waterford Community Care Area: Discussion (2 Feb 2016)

Mary Lou McDonald: I will come to that in a moment.

Public Accounts Committee: HSE Report on Foster Home in Waterford Community Care Area: Discussion (2 Feb 2016)

Mary Lou McDonald: I ask the questions and Mr. O'Brien answers them.

Public Accounts Committee: HSE Report on Foster Home in Waterford Community Care Area: Discussion (2 Feb 2016)

Mary Lou McDonald: In 1998, Ann would have turned 18. We need to figure this out and the delegates must be clear on it. Once Ann reached the age of majority, what was the status of the then health board in terms of its duty of care and what was the status of her family? I am raising this very particularly because the delegates are going to very great lengths to emphasise these were private arrangements. It...

Public Accounts Committee: HSE Report on Foster Home in Waterford Community Care Area: Discussion (2 Feb 2016)

Mary Lou McDonald: I am responding to Mr. O'Brien's words, and I am looking at them in black and white in front of me. At the point at which Ann turned 18 she became an adult, albeit a very vulnerable one. The health board was aware that there were issues with the foster home, which was then not a foster home. Why is it that Mr. O'Brien insists it was for her family to intervene and ensure her safety? Will...

Public Accounts Committee: HSE Report on Foster Home in Waterford Community Care Area: Discussion (2 Feb 2016)

Mary Lou McDonald: Hold on a second. All of that is in the documentation.

Public Accounts Committee: HSE Report on Foster Home in Waterford Community Care Area: Discussion (2 Feb 2016)

Mary Lou McDonald: I hope Mr. Healy is not deliberately missing my essential point, because his contention is that it fell to the family to make the call in respect of Ann's removal, albeit on a part-time basis, from this home. I am challenging Mr. Healy on that.

Public Accounts Committee: HSE Report on Foster Home in Waterford Community Care Area: Discussion (2 Feb 2016)

Mary Lou McDonald: I am challenging Mr. Healy on that because I actually do not accept it.

Public Accounts Committee: HSE Report on Foster Home in Waterford Community Care Area: Discussion (2 Feb 2016)

Mary Lou McDonald: I am sorry, Mr. Healy, but I am going to stop you right there. Not alone does Mr. O'Brien's initial statement emphasise the private nature of the arrangement in respect of Ann, but it goes on to reiterate that the family had confirmed that they had no concerns regarding the foster family or the level of care. Mr. Healy has already told Deputy Deasy that in his engagement with the family he...

Public Accounts Committee: HSE Report on Foster Home in Waterford Community Care Area: Discussion (2 Feb 2016)

Mary Lou McDonald: Do you know what I think you are doing, Mr. Healy? I think - if you do not mind - you are spoofing me.

Public Accounts Committee: HSE Report on Foster Home in Waterford Community Care Area: Discussion (2 Feb 2016)

Mary Lou McDonald: Let me tell you: I think you are spoofing. You are trying to bring us on a merry dance in respect of detail in reports that we cannot even see. Here is my proposition for the HSE and its predecessor organisation. I am putting it to it that it was its legal responsibility to ensure the safety of Ann. It carried that responsibility irrespective of the views of the family or the relationship...

Public Accounts Committee: HSE Report on Foster Home in Waterford Community Care Area: Discussion (2 Feb 2016)

Mary Lou McDonald: With whom did and does legal responsibility and onus rest in respect of the care and safety when a person with a severe intellectual disability who requires the care of the State turns 18? Where does it rest, Mr. O'Brien?

Public Accounts Committee: HSE Report on Foster Home in Waterford Community Care Area: Discussion (2 Feb 2016)

Mary Lou McDonald: I would like Mr. O'Brien to answer, please.

Public Accounts Committee: HSE Report on Foster Home in Waterford Community Care Area: Discussion (2 Feb 2016)

Mary Lou McDonald: With whom does the responsibility rest?

Public Accounts Committee: HSE Report on Foster Home in Waterford Community Care Area: Discussion (2 Feb 2016)

Mary Lou McDonald: As I see it, the onus and legal responsibility rested with the HSE. That is my understanding. I refer the delegates to the letter of apology. It is signed by Ms Colley. One of the matters for which there is an apology is an absence of the necessary protocols and arrangements to support the placement in foster families of vulnerable children and adults with a disability. The HSE concedes,...

Public Accounts Committee: HSE Report on Foster Home in Waterford Community Care Area: Discussion (2 Feb 2016)

Mary Lou McDonald: Mr. O'Brien said it in his opening statement.

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