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Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Rising Cost of Motor Insurance: Discussion (Resumed) (14 Sep 2016)

Paul Murphy: In response to the point about the profits being a necessary cost, there is an alternative here. That is why I think we should broaden the scope. There is a different model of insurance, which is a not-for-profit model in which we do not have to have this extra cost. That €2.86 billion was paid by people in premiums as a cost. If Mr. Dunne thinks, ideologically, that it is...

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Rising Cost of Motor Insurance: Discussion (Resumed) (14 Sep 2016)

Paul Murphy: I think Mr. Dunne would have a hard time convincing those who are now facing these massive hikes that the market is particularly efficient right now or is delivering for people. I thank Mr. Dunne for those responses. In terms of the Injuries Board, a big issue is the black box of lack of knowledge that we have, which is all that is not settled through the court or through the Injuries...

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Rising Cost of Motor Insurance: Discussion (Resumed) (14 Sep 2016)

Paul Murphy: At that endpoint, Mr. Watkins said that 7,000 or so claims are accepted by both parties. In cases in which it is only accepted by one party and rejected by the other, what is the balance?

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Rising Cost of Motor Insurance: Discussion (Resumed) (14 Sep 2016)

Paul Murphy: What I mean is that when the rejection takes place, is it a rejection by the respondent or the claimant?

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Rising Cost of Motor Insurance: Discussion (Resumed) (14 Sep 2016)

Paul Murphy: Mr. Watkins cannot speak for cases that are settled elsewhere, but in terms of the Injuries Board's own figures, has there been any increase in the amount that was awarded in terms of claims or in the volume of claims between 2015 and 2014, for example?

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Rising Cost of Motor Insurance: Discussion (Resumed) (14 Sep 2016)

Paul Murphy: The insurance companies talk quite a lot about fraud. Is fraud something that the Injuries Board has a category for and statistically takes note of to say that it rejected X number of claims because it believed that they were fraudulent? Does the Injuries Board have those figures?

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Rising Cost of Motor Insurance: Discussion (Resumed) (14 Sep 2016)

Paul Murphy: Okay. So they are accepting whatever percentage-----

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Rising Cost of Motor Insurance: Discussion (Resumed) (14 Sep 2016)

Paul Murphy: Okay. That is useful. Are there reforms that the witnesses think could be implemented that would make the work of the Injuries Board more effective and bring more people under its remit? What are they?

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Rising Cost of Motor Insurance: Discussion (Resumed) (13 Sep 2016)

Paul Murphy: I thank the witnesses for their presentations. They are a bit of fresh air in terms of some of the discussion we have heard. I agree with the analysis that there is quite an extensive propaganda war going on by the insurance industry. It has actually been quite successful and is reflected in some of the contributions we have had from people who are also victims. The two buzzwords used to...

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Rising Cost of Motor Insurance: Discussion (Resumed) (13 Sep 2016)

Paul Murphy: Mr. Conor Faughnan of the AA said that about 10% of the claims are resolved in court, 20% go through the Injuries Board and the rest of them are out-of-court private settlements. That is all in the black box Mr. Gilhooly mentioned. How does one go about getting that? Is there any legal difficulty with passing a law that provides for these things to be published because they are in the...

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Rising Cost of Motor Insurance: Discussion (Resumed) (13 Sep 2016)

Paul Murphy: How does that happen in reality? In an average case at what stage does it leave the formal process? Is it at that point before the Injuries Board or is it between the Injuries Board and the court?

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Rising Cost of Motor Insurance: Discussion (Resumed) (13 Sep 2016)

Paul Murphy: It is inevitable that there must be some fraud. However, fraud is often spoken about as if it is the factor driving premiums up and there is an absence of facts to accompany any of that. Can the witnesses give us facts on how many fraud prosecutions take place in a year? How many cases are dealt with in that way that it is exaggerated-----

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Rising Cost of Motor Insurance: Discussion (Resumed) (13 Sep 2016)

Paul Murphy: "Dismissed" as in their claim was dismissed?

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Rising Cost of Motor Insurance: Discussion (8 Sep 2016)

Paul Murphy: I thank the witnesses for the presentations, which are informative. To start with Mr. Faughnan and the AA, what is striking, and it confirms our empirical experience and, I am sure, that of the AA, is the survey which finds that of all the motoring issues car insurance is the No. 1 issue, with 93% of people saying it is the most important issue. Mr. Faughnan used the formulation, which is...

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Rising Cost of Motor Insurance: Discussion (8 Sep 2016)

Paul Murphy: That is also our experience. On the question of the older cars, and we have younger drivers and older drivers represented, what is the insurance company's justification for higher premiums for older cars? I understand there can be a point in terms of older cars not having the same safety equipment - roll barriers and so on - inside the car that newer cars would have. Is that it or is there...

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Rising Cost of Motor Insurance: Discussion (8 Sep 2016)

Paul Murphy: Effectively, that profiling is targeting younger drivers and lower income drivers. Is it consciously the case that-----

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Rising Cost of Motor Insurance: Discussion (8 Sep 2016)

Paul Murphy: Mr. Faughnan says it is not about the car.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Rising Cost of Motor Insurance: Discussion (8 Sep 2016)

Paul Murphy: It is about the profile. I understand that. That makes sense, but what is the problem with the profile of people who have older cars? Are they more likely to claim?

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Rising Cost of Motor Insurance: Discussion (8 Sep 2016)

Paul Murphy: Mr. Faughnan mentioned also the car insurance companies undermining the Personal Injuries Assessment Board. I presume the figure of 20% used to be higher and that it has come down. How does it work in practice? How do they act in order to undermine it?

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Rising Cost of Motor Insurance: Discussion (8 Sep 2016)

Paul Murphy: An issue for this committee and for everyone who follows these proceedings is assessing the balance in terms of the causation factors for the premiums increasing. Obviously, an element of that is profit. According to the blue book, over the past 20 years, something like €2.86 billion in pre-tax profit has been made by insurance companies. It is a lot of money. Clearly, if the profit...

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