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Public Accounts Committee: HSE Financial Statement 2015 (15 Jul 2016)

Mary Lou McDonald: I would like Mr. Raleigh to be as expansive as he can in terms of the minutes he can provide to us. What was Mr. Raleigh's relationship with Mr. Kelly? Would he have known him professionally over the years?

Public Accounts Committee: HSE Financial Statement 2015 (15 Jul 2016)

Mary Lou McDonald: Would that also have been the case for Mr. Raleigh's predecessor, Mr. Day?

Public Accounts Committee: HSE Financial Statement 2015 (15 Jul 2016)

Mary Lou McDonald: Okay. Where is Mr. Day now?

Public Accounts Committee: HSE Financial Statement 2015 (15 Jul 2016)

Mary Lou McDonald: Is Mr. Raleigh still in contact with him?

Public Accounts Committee: HSE Financial Statement 2015 (15 Jul 2016)

Mary Lou McDonald: Okay. When Mr. Raleigh rang him, did Mr. Raleigh ask him if he responded to the letter that has been raised by Deputy Connolly, the correspondence from Jean Casey, back in 2006? That raised not just clinical issues about clinical supervision, but also governance issues. Did Mr. Day respond to that letter?

Public Accounts Committee: HSE Financial Statement 2015 (15 Jul 2016)

Mary Lou McDonald: Okay. In that response he says, "As Console's major funder, your concerns have to be raised urgently by the National Office for Suicide Prevention". He attached a great deal of importance to this letter from Ms Casey, did he not?

Public Accounts Committee: HSE Financial Statement 2015 (15 Jul 2016)

Mary Lou McDonald: I would think it is manifestly so from the letter, which I have in my hand.

Public Accounts Committee: HSE Financial Statement 2015 (15 Jul 2016)

Mary Lou McDonald: Then what happened next?.

Public Accounts Committee: HSE Financial Statement 2015 (15 Jul 2016)

Mary Lou McDonald: What did Mr. Day do next?

Public Accounts Committee: HSE Financial Statement 2015 (15 Jul 2016)

Mary Lou McDonald: Did Mr. Day write to Mr. Kelly?

Public Accounts Committee: HSE Financial Statement 2015 (15 Jul 2016)

Mary Lou McDonald: Is there not a record on file, an unsigned letter, from Mr. Day to Mr. Kelly?

Public Accounts Committee: HSE Financial Statement 2015 (15 Jul 2016)

Mary Lou McDonald: Right. I am going to put it to Mr. Raleigh that there is. I think, Chairman, albeit that Mr. Day is retired, it is my understanding that he had a very clear analysis of how serious things were in respect of Console. I accept entirely that Mr. Raleigh cannot answer for a situation when he was not in position, but if we are to get to the bottom of what happened here and why, I suggest,...

Public Accounts Committee: HSE Financial Statement 2015 (15 Jul 2016)

Mary Lou McDonald: I will try to help Mr. O'Brien, because I am not theorising or giving vent to my idiosyncratic suspicions. I am looking at a memorandum to Geoff Day, director, National Office for Suicide Prevention from a Declan Behan, SEO in the National Office for Suicide Prevention. It is dated 1 February 2009 and it sets out a review of documentation going back to 2004 and raises very serious concerns...

Public Accounts Committee: HSE Financial Statement 2015 (15 Jul 2016)

Mary Lou McDonald: I have it here.

Public Accounts Committee: HSE Financial Statement 2015 (15 Jul 2016)

Mary Lou McDonald: I do not know. I will be happy to make it available if that helps.

Public Accounts Committee: HSE Financial Statement 2015 (15 Jul 2016)

Mary Lou McDonald: I accept the point. I am raising this not to bamboozle the committee but to illustrate that the HSE had plenty of internal correspondence to identify, without a shadow of doubt, that it was dealing with a deeply problematic situation. It might be helpful if the committee asked the HSE to provide all of the correspondence between the HSE and Console, including the internal e-mails, memoranda...

Public Accounts Committee: HSE Financial Statement 2015 (15 Jul 2016)

Mary Lou McDonald: I have a limited amount of time and I wish to move to a second issue. That might be Mr. O'Brien's judgment but he cannot ask this committee to make any judgment, good, bad or indifferent-----

Public Accounts Committee: HSE Financial Statement 2015 (15 Jul 2016)

Mary Lou McDonald: -----without sight of everything. That includes internal memoranda and e-mails between persons within the HSE and the Department of Health. We need full access to that information.

Public Accounts Committee: HSE Financial Statement 2015 (15 Jul 2016)

Mary Lou McDonald: I thank Mr. O'Brien. I have a question about the situation in St. John of God services. Mr. O'Brien said in his opening remarks that he wrote - I remember it well - to all the section 38 organisations. That was back in 2013.

Public Accounts Committee: HSE Financial Statement 2015 (15 Jul 2016)

Mary Lou McDonald: He wrote to them to inquire about compliance. At that stage there were several stand-out examples of non-compliance. Mr. O'Brien wrote to them. Did they write back to him in 2013?

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