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Public Accounts Committee: Special Report No. 94 of the Comptroller and Auditor General: National Asset Management Agency Sale of Project Eagle (Resumed) (18 Oct 2016)

Mary Lou McDonald: I draw the delegates’ attention to the board minutes of 3 April. This was the meeting at which the board finally signed off on the deal with Cerberus. At this point, the board asked for confirmation-----

Public Accounts Committee: Special Report No. 94 of the Comptroller and Auditor General: National Asset Management Agency Sale of Project Eagle (Resumed) (18 Oct 2016)

Mary Lou McDonald: It is on page 121. Mindful of the scenario that had gone before around fixers' fees, the board approached Cerberus to get certain comfort in respect of fixers' fees and was advised that it had agreed a success fee with Brown Rudnick. The board would have known Brown Rudnick’s role in the previous PIMCO scenario. Following further clarification, the board discovered Brown Rudnick had...

Public Accounts Committee: Special Report No. 94 of the Comptroller and Auditor General: National Asset Management Agency Sale of Project Eagle (Resumed) (18 Oct 2016)

Mary Lou McDonald: Did the board specifically ask about Mr. Frank Cushnahan? Is there a piece of paper, was there a phone call, is it recorded anywhere that questions were asked about Mr. Cushnahan specifically?

Public Accounts Committee: Special Report No. 94 of the Comptroller and Auditor General: National Asset Management Agency Sale of Project Eagle (Resumed) (18 Oct 2016)

Mary Lou McDonald: It strikes me as remarkably coy.

Public Accounts Committee: Special Report No. 94 of the Comptroller and Auditor General: National Asset Management Agency Sale of Project Eagle (Resumed) (18 Oct 2016)

Mary Lou McDonald: Does Mr. Soffe still accept that that assurance holds water?

Public Accounts Committee: Special Report No. 94 of the Comptroller and Auditor General: National Asset Management Agency Sale of Project Eagle (Resumed) (18 Oct 2016)

Mary Lou McDonald: Mr. Soffe knows that there are several investigations under way-----

Public Accounts Committee: Special Report No. 94 of the Comptroller and Auditor General: National Asset Management Agency Sale of Project Eagle (Resumed) (18 Oct 2016)

Mary Lou McDonald: -----not least in this jurisdiction, where one is soon to be established, as well as in the Northern jurisdiction and America. That was not a good day's work by NAMA, was it?

Public Accounts Committee: Special Report No. 94 of the Comptroller and Auditor General: National Asset Management Agency Sale of Project Eagle (Resumed) (18 Oct 2016)

Mary Lou McDonald: If Mr. McEnery does not mind me saying so, that makes it all the more extraordinary that the direct question was not put at any stage in relation to Mr. Cushnahan.

Public Accounts Committee: Special Report No. 94 of the Comptroller and Auditor General: National Asset Management Agency Sale of Project Eagle (Resumed) (18 Oct 2016)

Mary Lou McDonald: Does Mr. Soffe think I am making a big deal out of nothing? Is that the case? In that regard, I direct him to the board's minutes of 11 March which are recorded on page 116 and 117 of the report. It is at this stage that the head of asset recovery, Ronnie Hanna, tells the board about the conversation with PIMCO. It is fascinating to note the following statement on page 117:Following...

Public Accounts Committee: Special Report No. 94 of the Comptroller and Auditor General: National Asset Management Agency Sale of Project Eagle (Resumed) (18 Oct 2016)

Mary Lou McDonald: How does one tell the dancer from the dance or what is real and perceived?

Public Accounts Committee: Special Report No. 94 of the Comptroller and Auditor General: National Asset Management Agency Sale of Project Eagle (Resumed) (18 Oct 2016)

Mary Lou McDonald: He probably did not need it as he was advising seven debtors who represented 50% of the portfolio. I suggest he did not necessarily have to come to the board's meeting to have extensive debtor information. The meeting then heard that the payment to Mr. Cushnahan was a significant issue, of which Mr. Soffe made great play. However, at no stage in any of the documentation is it reflected...

Public Accounts Committee: Special Report No. 94 of the Comptroller and Auditor General: National Asset Management Agency Sale of Project Eagle (Resumed) (18 Oct 2016)

Mary Lou McDonald: It may have been fatally flawed, yes.

Public Accounts Committee: Special Report No. 94 of the Comptroller and Auditor General: National Asset Management Agency Sale of Project Eagle (Resumed) (18 Oct 2016)

Mary Lou McDonald: The witnesses argue that PIMCO tried to manoeuvre to get NAMA on side with something that should not have been going on. It tried to sidestep compliance and regulation. Is that not their contention? It is a very serious thing to suggest.

Public Accounts Committee: Special Report No. 94 of the Comptroller and Auditor General: National Asset Management Agency Sale of Project Eagle (Resumed) (18 Oct 2016)

Mary Lou McDonald: It is in the board's minutes that PIMCO tried to secure the board's acquiescence to this dodgy manoeuvre.

Public Accounts Committee: Special Report No. 94 of the Comptroller and Auditor General: National Asset Management Agency Sale of Project Eagle (Resumed) (18 Oct 2016)

Mary Lou McDonald: We are trying to unravel what happened and can only go on what is in front of us. The minutes tell us that the board discussed the issue and it was stated - this is faithfully recorded - that PIMCO was trying to pull a quick one.

Public Accounts Committee: Special Report No. 94 of the Comptroller and Auditor General: National Asset Management Agency Sale of Project Eagle (Resumed) (18 Oct 2016)

Mary Lou McDonald: The conversations we have just gone through in Appendix E comprehensively refute that assertion because, according to this material, that is not the conversation that was had with PIMCO.

Public Accounts Committee: Special Report No. 94 of the Comptroller and Auditor General: National Asset Management Agency Sale of Project Eagle (Resumed) (18 Oct 2016)

Mary Lou McDonald: In other words, Ronnie Hanna and the other person, NAMA's senior divisional manager - legal - I do not know if the witnesses wish to tell us who it is or was - were essentially on a solo run. That is the witnesses' position on the issue.

Public Accounts Committee: Special Report No. 94 of the Comptroller and Auditor General: National Asset Management Agency Sale of Project Eagle (Resumed) (18 Oct 2016)

Mary Lou McDonald: I have no doubt that we will return to it at future hearings.

Public Accounts Committee: Special Report No. 94 of the Comptroller and Auditor General: National Asset Management Agency Sale of Project Eagle (Resumed) (18 Oct 2016)

Mary Lou McDonald: I assume I will be able to contribute again.

Public Accounts Committee: Special Report No. 94 of the Comptroller and Auditor General: National Asset Management Agency Sale of Project Eagle (Resumed) (18 Oct 2016)

Mary Lou McDonald: The witnesses have been very aggressive and dogmatic in making many of their assertions. The difficulty arises when one reads the board minutes. In that regard, I am zeroing in on the issue of PIMCO because I believe it is at the core of how the board did its business and the witnesses' stewardship of the board. The assertion that the board was insistent as regards PIMCO is not reflected...

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