Results 81-100 of 1,034,306 for in 'Dáil debates' OR in 'Committee meetings' (speaker:Shane Cassells OR speaker:Réada Cronin OR speaker:Sorca Clarke)
- Criminal Justice (Amendment) Bill 2024: Committee and Remaining Stages (25 Sep 2024)
Brendan Howlin: There is no reference to murder. Section 156 of the Children Act 2001 states: "No court shall pass a sentence of imprisonment on a child or commit a child to prison." That is what the law of the land states. A child who offends can be made subject to a detention order under that Act but, under the Minister's proposal, aged-out children can be sent to prison. Is that not a fact?
- Criminal Justice (Amendment) Bill 2024: Committee and Remaining Stages (25 Sep 2024)
Helen McEntee: If we were to accept this amendment, there would be statutory sentencing for murder.
- Criminal Justice (Amendment) Bill 2024: Committee and Remaining Stages (25 Sep 2024)
Brendan Howlin: If I withdraw the amendment now, a court could impose a prison sentence on an aged-out child. The Minister told us yesterday that aged-out children could be sentenced to life imprisonment, in fact. I am trying to understand the Minister's own proposal. If I withdraw the amendment, what will be the state of the law? Will it be open to a court to send such an aged-out child to prison for murder?
- Criminal Justice (Amendment) Bill 2024: Committee and Remaining Stages (25 Sep 2024)
Helen McEntee: No. It will fall back on the common law.
- Criminal Justice (Amendment) Bill 2024: Committee and Remaining Stages (25 Sep 2024)
Brendan Howlin: The Minister's officials are saying "Yes", so it will be.
- Criminal Justice (Amendment) Bill 2024: Committee and Remaining Stages (25 Sep 2024)
Helen McEntee: There is an option there but-----
- Criminal Justice (Amendment) Bill 2024: Committee and Remaining Stages (25 Sep 2024)
Brendan Howlin: It is possible, then, to send an aged-out adult to prison. It is not possible to commit a child to prison. There is no equality.
- Criminal Justice (Amendment) Bill 2024: Committee and Remaining Stages (25 Sep 2024)
Helen McEntee: It is this Act that we are amending, not the 2001 Act.
- Criminal Justice (Amendment) Bill 2024: Committee and Remaining Stages (25 Sep 2024)
Brendan Howlin: I quoted the Children Act because the Minister said it would default to the Children Act in terms of equality. An adult cannot be treated as a child.
- Criminal Justice (Amendment) Bill 2024: Committee and Remaining Stages (25 Sep 2024)
Helen McEntee: It will default to the way in which it is defined under the Children Act in relation to murder, which is common law.
- Criminal Justice (Amendment) Bill 2024: Committee and Remaining Stages (25 Sep 2024)
Seán Ó Fearghaíl: While I do not wish to get involved in this discussion, what I do not understand is that the Minister is saying that, in the event of a child ageing out and having been found guilty, instead of having a sentence to be handed down or not handed down, it is a matter for the judge to determine in the courts. 7 o’clock It is a matter for the judge to determine in accordance, not...
- Criminal Justice (Amendment) Bill 2024: Committee and Remaining Stages (25 Sep 2024)
Helen McEntee: I thank the Deputy. I acknowledge and thank him and the members of the committee for waiving pre-legislative scrutiny and acknowledging this is very specific and very much responding to the High Court ruling and the need to ensure equality between children and children who have aged out when it comes to the sentencing and the timeline. There are two elements to the amendment. The first...
- Criminal Justice (Amendment) Bill 2024: Committee and Remaining Stages (25 Sep 2024)
Brendan Howlin: It is not in any statute, that is my point.
- Criminal Justice (Amendment) Bill 2024: Committee and Remaining Stages (25 Sep 2024)
Helen McEntee: To the second point, the amendment itself specifically references the aged-out child and references murder. Again, the legal advice I have is the Children Act 2001 disapplied any specific sentence specific to murder. While there may be a general sentence, there is no specific statutory sentence for children relating to murder, whereas this would place a specific statutory sentence on the...
- Criminal Justice (Amendment) Bill 2024: Committee and Remaining Stages (25 Sep 2024)
Brendan Howlin: It does not.
- Criminal Justice (Amendment) Bill 2024: Committee and Remaining Stages (25 Sep 2024)
Helen McEntee: The discrepancy we are trying to remove inserts this on the other side. There is a second element to this. There is a Supreme Court case which is looking at murder as it applies to a child. Apologies that I did not say this earlier but this particular case has the potential to require further changes in legislation. The Children Act is being worked on at the moment, and there is an...
- Criminal Justice (Amendment) Bill 2024: Committee and Remaining Stages (25 Sep 2024)
Brendan Howlin: I am trying to follow the Minister's logic. We can only deal with the law as is and the laws we are creating, not what might come down from another judgment of the superior courts that might have implications for the law. My difficulty with this, to follow the Minister's logic, is that any child under the age of 18 who is convicted of murder and sentenced in court cannot, under the 2001...
- Criminal Justice (Amendment) Bill 2024: Committee and Remaining Stages (25 Sep 2024)
Helen McEntee: The objective of the Bill is to provide that level playing field and that equality. Where the 2001 Act is silent is specific to murder, so by including the amendment, where we are specifically referencing murder to the aged-out child, where it is not specifically referenced to children in the 2001 Children Act, and I appreciate this is where we are talking about-----
- Criminal Justice (Amendment) Bill 2024: Committee and Remaining Stages (25 Sep 2024)
Seán Ó Fearghaíl: To clarify, Minister, it is the use of the term "murder" as distinct from the sentence.
- Criminal Justice (Amendment) Bill 2024: Committee and Remaining Stages (25 Sep 2024)
Helen McEntee: There is no specific reference. The 2001 Act is silent on murder.