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Joint Oireachtas Committee on Health: National Cervical Screening Programme: Department of Health, HSE, CervicalCheck and the National Cancer Control Programme (2 May 2018)

Louise O'Reilly: Is the information available per each laboratory? It may not be published. Will the HSE publish it?

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Health: National Cervical Screening Programme: Department of Health, HSE, CervicalCheck and the National Cancer Control Programme (2 May 2018)

Louise O'Reilly: I am sorry, Chairman. How soon can that be done?

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Health: National Cervical Screening Programme: Department of Health, HSE, CervicalCheck and the National Cancer Control Programme (2 May 2018)

Louise O'Reilly: Okay, so we could get it tomorrow. That would be very helpful.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Health: National Cervical Screening Programme: Department of Health, HSE, CervicalCheck and the National Cancer Control Programme (2 May 2018)

Louise O'Reilly: I know we will have another opportunity to ask questions. I want to home in if I can on who knew what, at what stage. I am reading from a letter that was copied to Dr. Henry and Mr. McKenna from a consultant gynaecologist and it is dated 22 August 2017. It states: "What has happened is totally inappropriate." That is referring to withholding of information from women. What I want to know...

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Health: National Cervical Screening Programme: Department of Health, HSE, CervicalCheck and the National Cancer Control Programme (2 May 2018)

Louise O'Reilly: My apologies, Chairman, but a significant amount of time was taken up with a very long and detailed explanation for which we are very grateful to Dr. Holohan, but it did use up a considerable amount of time. Could I have Mr. O'Brien’s and Mr. McKenna's view on that?

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Health: National Cervical Screening Programme: Department of Health, HSE, CervicalCheck and the National Cancer Control Programme (2 May 2018)

Louise O'Reilly: That serious issues were raised with senior members of Mr. O'Brien's organisation, and he expects us to believe that they chose not to tell him and that he was not informed. Does Mr. O'Brien consider that important information, which we are now all here talking about, was withheld from him, or would it be routine and he simply did not ask? I am curious to know because, as previously...

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Health: National Cervical Screening Programme: Department of Health, HSE, CervicalCheck and the National Cancer Control Programme (2 May 2018)

Louise O'Reilly: Is this not something Mr. O'Brien thinks he should have known about?

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Health: National Cervical Screening Programme: Department of Health, HSE, CervicalCheck and the National Cancer Control Programme (2 May 2018)

Louise O'Reilly: I am sorry about this, Chairman. When Mr. O'Brien found out on the television, as he has told us - I said that stretches credibility - did he then start asking questions? Is he aware of this correspondence now? Where did he go when he started to look for this information?

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Health: National Cervical Screening Programme: Department of Health, HSE, CervicalCheck and the National Cancer Control Programme (2 May 2018)

Louise O'Reilly: Since this correspondence refers directly to that case, and the withholding of information and all that goes along with it, could I have Mr. O'Brien’s view on it now?

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Health: National Cervical Screening Programme: Department of Health, HSE, CervicalCheck and the National Cancer Control Programme (2 May 2018)

Louise O'Reilly: Is Mr. O'Brien not going to express a view on something of this nature? I would have thought this would have formed part of it. It is a very senior clinician expressing some very serious views about the withholding of information from women, but Mr. O'Brien does not want to comment on it. When people say they do not have confidence in Mr. O'Brien-----

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Health: National Cervical Screening Programme: Department of Health, HSE, CervicalCheck and the National Cancer Control Programme (2 May 2018)

Louise O'Reilly: -----it is when he gives answers like this that causes people to say that.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Health: National Cervical Screening Programme: Department of Health, HSE, CervicalCheck and the National Cancer Control Programme (2 May 2018)

Louise O'Reilly: It is an important piece of correspondence and Mr. O'Brien is telling me he has not seen it. I find that quite unbelievable because it is very material to what we are discussing here today. I am sorry, Chairman, I am way over my time.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Health: National Cervical Screening Programme: Department of Health, HSE, CervicalCheck and the National Cancer Control Programme (2 May 2018)

Louise O'Reilly: Quite some time.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Health: National Cervical Screening Programme: Department of Health, HSE, CervicalCheck and the National Cancer Control Programme (2 May 2018)

Louise O'Reilly: Time flies when one is having fun. It feels like we have been here for 20 hours. I thank all the witnesses for remaining with us this evening. The committee members are aware that the meeting has been prolonged but we have questions which must be answered. Two people in this room - Dr. McKenna and Dr. Henry - received the letter from Vicky Phelan's consultant. I do not understand what...

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Health: National Cervical Screening Programme: Department of Health, HSE, CervicalCheck and the National Cancer Control Programme (2 May 2018)

Louise O'Reilly: Led to believe by whom?

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Health: National Cervical Screening Programme: Department of Health, HSE, CervicalCheck and the National Cancer Control Programme (2 May 2018)

Louise O'Reilly: It is quite late in the evening and I would prefer if Dr. McKenna were not vague in his answers. How high up did this go? He is a very senior person in the HSE structure and was such when he received the letter. Did he feel the need to give it to a more senior person? Did he speak to people on the same level as himself? Did he inform the Department? Were any other letters of that nature...

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Health: National Cervical Screening Programme: Department of Health, HSE, CervicalCheck and the National Cancer Control Programme (2 May 2018)

Louise O'Reilly: Is Mr. O'Brien satisfied that the appropriate action was taken at the time?

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Health: National Cervical Screening Programme: Department of Health, HSE, CervicalCheck and the National Cancer Control Programme (2 May 2018)

Louise O'Reilly: While we are discussing accountability, who does Mr. O'Brien consider should be held accountable?

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Health: National Cervical Screening Programme: Department of Health, HSE, CervicalCheck and the National Cancer Control Programme (2 May 2018)

Louise O'Reilly: It is late in the evening. Is Mr. O'Brien going to say it is the fault of those who did not do their job but fail to identify those people? I am on the record as stating that the buck stops with Mr. O'Brien.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Health: National Cervical Screening Programme: Department of Health, HSE, CervicalCheck and the National Cancer Control Programme (2 May 2018)

Louise O'Reilly: That answer has caused even more confusion. I suspect that might have been its intention. Has Dr. McKenna or Dr. Henry been promoted since then?

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