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Public Accounts Committee: Special Report No. 94 of the Comptroller and Auditor General: National Asset Management Agency Sale of Project Eagle (Resumed) (18 Oct 2016)

Mary Lou McDonald: Then what is meant by that statement?

Public Accounts Committee: Special Report No. 94 of the Comptroller and Auditor General: National Asset Management Agency Sale of Project Eagle (Resumed) (18 Oct 2016)

Mary Lou McDonald: I do not accept that, but we will come back to that issue. At another point of his statement, on page 6, Mr. Soffe states: "The Board rejects the C&AG’s unsubstantiated suggestion that serious credible bidders were excluded from the process." He is asserting not simply that people were excluded but also that there was an "unsubstantiated suggestion," as he puts it. In so stating,...

Public Accounts Committee: Special Report No. 94 of the Comptroller and Auditor General: National Asset Management Agency Sale of Project Eagle (Resumed) (18 Oct 2016)

Mary Lou McDonald: We have had some witnesses appear before us and we will hear from more. One thing marks out the Comptroller and Auditor General and the report in that every assertion made, regardless of whether the witnesses accept it or not, is fully substantiated and, unlike NAMA, is actually backed up by what was an extensive trawl, consideration and examination of the material available to the office...

Public Accounts Committee: Special Report No. 94 of the Comptroller and Auditor General: National Asset Management Agency Sale of Project Eagle (Resumed) (18 Oct 2016)

Mary Lou McDonald: I did not make reference to the discount factor-----

Public Accounts Committee: Special Report No. 94 of the Comptroller and Auditor General: National Asset Management Agency Sale of Project Eagle (Resumed) (18 Oct 2016)

Mary Lou McDonald: There has been quite a substantial discussion on that. I referenced in particular the issue of conflicts of interest and the issue of exclusion of credible bidders.

Public Accounts Committee: Special Report No. 94 of the Comptroller and Auditor General: National Asset Management Agency Sale of Project Eagle (Resumed) (18 Oct 2016)

Mary Lou McDonald: I am sure Mr. Soffe also accepts that within the report of the Comptroller and Auditor General, views from other bidders who found the process to be unsatisfactory, to say the least, are given. They raised a series of concerns that were simply recorded by the Comptroller and Auditor General in terms of valuations and the very obvious fact that PIMCO had a head start on all other comers. I...

Public Accounts Committee: Special Report No. 94 of the Comptroller and Auditor General: National Asset Management Agency Sale of Project Eagle (Resumed) (18 Oct 2016)

Mary Lou McDonald: What I am trying to get to is Mr. Soffe's acceptance of the facts as reflected by the Comptroller and Auditor General that a number of bidders and potential bidders were less than happy with the process NAMA ran. Can Mr. Soffe accept that?

Public Accounts Committee: Special Report No. 94 of the Comptroller and Auditor General: National Asset Management Agency Sale of Project Eagle (Resumed) (18 Oct 2016)

Mary Lou McDonald: -----throughout the text. Therefore, his assertions and observations are substantiated.

Public Accounts Committee: Special Report No. 94 of the Comptroller and Auditor General: National Asset Management Agency Sale of Project Eagle (Resumed) (18 Oct 2016)

Mary Lou McDonald: That is not the question I put to Mr. Soffe. I put it to him that he has made a very serious charge against a constitutional office of this State that a report produced by that office was based on unsubstantiated suggestions and any reading of the report does not support that description.

Public Accounts Committee: Special Report No. 94 of the Comptroller and Auditor General: National Asset Management Agency Sale of Project Eagle (Resumed) (18 Oct 2016)

Mary Lou McDonald: That is not the question. I am affording Mr. Soffe and his colleagues an opportunity to withdraw what I think is very intemperate language and an assertion over which they could not possibly stand. Regardless of their difference around conclusions, to suggest that matters are unsubstantiated in this report is just wrong. I suggest that Mr. Soffe avails of the opportunity to withdraw that...

Public Accounts Committee: Special Report No. 94 of the Comptroller and Auditor General: National Asset Management Agency Sale of Project Eagle (Resumed) (18 Oct 2016)

Mary Lou McDonald: The report contains criticisms of the sales process. Mr. Soffe has accepted that, has he not?

Public Accounts Committee: Special Report No. 94 of the Comptroller and Auditor General: National Asset Management Agency Sale of Project Eagle (Resumed) (18 Oct 2016)

Mary Lou McDonald: It is there - black on white. I am sure we will hear in the course of our hearings from some of these bidders and they may reiterate their concerns with the process.

Public Accounts Committee: Special Report No. 94 of the Comptroller and Auditor General: National Asset Management Agency Sale of Project Eagle (Resumed) (18 Oct 2016)

Mary Lou McDonald: I am not asking Mr. Soffe to-----

Public Accounts Committee: Special Report No. 94 of the Comptroller and Auditor General: National Asset Management Agency Sale of Project Eagle (Resumed) (18 Oct 2016)

Mary Lou McDonald: I am sure the witnesses take my point. I hope they take it, particularly Mr. Soffe. He has made reference to his record in public service. He does not lightly appear before an Oireachtas committee and attempt to question or trash the Office of the Comptroller and Auditor General, a constitutional office. Does he take that point?

Public Accounts Committee: Special Report No. 94 of the Comptroller and Auditor General: National Asset Management Agency Sale of Project Eagle (Resumed) (18 Oct 2016)

Mary Lou McDonald: In so doing, they are attacking rather unjustly and in an unfounded way. The witnesses made another assertion in the course of this morning which relates to PIMCO and the manner of its withdrawal from the sales process. Deputy Cullinane raised this issue with the witnesses earlier. They have suggested that having discovered these unethical and inappropriate success or finder fees, PIMCO...

Public Accounts Committee: Special Report No. 94 of the Comptroller and Auditor General: National Asset Management Agency Sale of Project Eagle (Resumed) (18 Oct 2016)

Mary Lou McDonald: The minutes reflect that according to the witnesses' narrative, PIMCO sought the acquiescence of NAMA. Is that still the witnesses' position?

Public Accounts Committee: Special Report No. 94 of the Comptroller and Auditor General: National Asset Management Agency Sale of Project Eagle (Resumed) (18 Oct 2016)

Mary Lou McDonald: Does Mr. Soffe understand the seriousness of making that assertion?

Public Accounts Committee: Special Report No. 94 of the Comptroller and Auditor General: National Asset Management Agency Sale of Project Eagle (Resumed) (18 Oct 2016)

Mary Lou McDonald: The very reason PIMCO approached NAMA and not vice versawas because it had unearthed this fact and in terms of not just what is ethical but what is legal and in compliance with the regulatory framework it is bound to, this caused a massive problem for it. PIMCO approached NAMA, not vice versa. We can agree on that.

Public Accounts Committee: Special Report No. 94 of the Comptroller and Auditor General: National Asset Management Agency Sale of Project Eagle (Resumed) (18 Oct 2016)

Mary Lou McDonald: I will come to that in a moment. We have established that the legal and compliance unit approached NAMA. The witnesses' contention is that having approached in that way, the legal and compliance division of PIMCO then sought to sidestep its regulatory and legal duties in an effort to stay within the process with NAMA's acquiescence. That is what the witnesses have told us today.

Public Accounts Committee: Special Report No. 94 of the Comptroller and Auditor General: National Asset Management Agency Sale of Project Eagle (Resumed) (18 Oct 2016)

Mary Lou McDonald: Why did it approach NAMA then?

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