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Joint Oireachtas Committee on Jobs, Enterprise and Innovation: Consumer Protection (Amendment) Bill 2017: Discussion (2 Oct 2018)

Mary Butler: Absolutely. I call Deputy Neville.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Jobs, Enterprise and Innovation: Consumer Protection (Amendment) Bill 2017: Discussion (2 Oct 2018)

Mary Butler: That is a very fair point. To summarise, this is a pro-consumer Bill, which is most important. We are currently at a crossroads. I read recently that by 2020, 80% of all clothes will be bought online. We have high streets and towns and villages everywhere that are crying out for footfall. I know we get the footfall at Christmas. As Senator Humphreys has said, if one goes into one's...

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Jobs, Enterprise and Innovation: Consumer Protection (Amendment) Bill 2017: Discussion (2 Oct 2018)

Mary Butler: I thank the Deputy and I propose that we now suspend the meeting for a moment to allow the Department officials to take their seats. Is that agreed? Agreed.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Jobs, Enterprise and Innovation: Consumer Protection (Amendment) Bill 2017: Discussion (2 Oct 2018)

Mary Butler: I welcome from the Department of Business, Enterprise and Innovation, Mr. Kieran Grace, principal officer; Mr. Billy Cox, assistant principal officer; and Ms Emma Hanrahan, executive officer, all of whom are attached to the competition and consumer policy section, to the meeting to scrutinise the Consumer Protection (Amendment) Bill 2017. I have already read out the procedures, and the...

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Jobs, Enterprise and Innovation: Consumer Protection (Amendment) Bill 2017: Discussion (2 Oct 2018)

Mary Butler: I thank Mr. Grace. We will now take questions from members.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Jobs, Enterprise and Innovation: Consumer Protection (Amendment) Bill 2017: Discussion (2 Oct 2018)

Mary Butler: It would be very helpful for us to understand it. When one looks at the draft scheme of the Government Bill, as we will call it to differentiate it from Deputy Niall Collins's Bill, the aim is the same. All the Bills that have been proposed seem to mention the five-year term. One might have mentioned a three-year term. There is general consensus that we need regulation of the sector....

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Jobs, Enterprise and Innovation: Consumer Protection (Amendment) Bill 2017: Discussion (2 Oct 2018)

Mary Butler: That would be very helpful. The witnesses have said there is one major drawback. I underlined it. The Department feels that, as drafted, the Consumer Protection (Amendment) Bill 2017 is not suitable. A minor issue still took a page and a half to explain.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Jobs, Enterprise and Innovation: Consumer Protection (Amendment) Bill 2017: Discussion (2 Oct 2018)

Mary Butler: There is a roadway there.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Jobs, Enterprise and Innovation: Consumer Protection (Amendment) Bill 2017: Discussion (2 Oct 2018)

Mary Butler: My question was along similar lines. I want to tease out something Mr. Grace said. Lots of people use gift vouchers within a short space of time but if they have a gift voucher for a photographer, for example, they might wait until the next year to use it because they might have a holy communion or confirmation in their family. In that case, the gift voucher might be lying in a drawer for...

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Jobs, Enterprise and Innovation: Consumer Protection (Amendment) Bill 2017: Discussion (2 Oct 2018)

Mary Butler: People would have to be informed of changes.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Jobs, Enterprise and Innovation: Consumer Protection (Amendment) Bill 2017: Discussion (2 Oct 2018)

Mary Butler: I understand the witnesses cannot comment on the money message and I should not have asked them to but I was just trying to tease out exactly where the costs were. Mr. Cox and Mr. Grace stated there would be awareness and enforcement costs. I do not think those costs would be such that it could prevent a Bill going forward. Some Bills would be way more costly to the State. I went over...

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Jobs, Enterprise and Innovation: Consumer Protection (Amendment) Bill 2017: Discussion (2 Oct 2018)

Mary Butler: That was my next question. Is there any regulation of those fees?

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Jobs, Enterprise and Innovation: Consumer Protection (Amendment) Bill 2017: Discussion (2 Oct 2018)

Mary Butler: I thank Mr. Cox for his informative explanation. I have heard people complaining that they thought they had €30 or €40 on a voucher and, when they go to spend it, they discover that is not the case. If the value of the voucher is falling by €1.45 every month, it reduces very quickly. We are all familiar with One4All voucher, especially when different companies and...

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Jobs, Enterprise and Innovation: Consumer Protection (Amendment) Bill 2017: Discussion (2 Oct 2018)

Mary Butler: One will not notice it.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Jobs, Enterprise and Innovation: Consumer Protection (Amendment) Bill 2017: Discussion (2 Oct 2018)

Mary Butler: Can I ask a couple of other questions in response to the recent public consultation? Did many people engage in the public consultation? It was noteworthy that the likes of Retail Ireland, who represent more than 3,000 outlets, and Chambers Ireland, supported the expiry date of five years and Retail Excellence supported three years. That was cohesive and all of those organisations were...

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Jobs, Enterprise and Innovation: Consumer Protection (Amendment) Bill 2017: Discussion (2 Oct 2018)

Mary Butler: That is a low enough number.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Jobs, Enterprise and Innovation: Consumer Protection (Amendment) Bill 2017: Discussion (2 Oct 2018)

Mary Butler: Forty-four submissions in public consultation is quite low. Some of those were multiples that were representing different organisations. How do public consultations work? Does the Department advertise in newspapers and online? Is that the gist of it?

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Jobs, Enterprise and Innovation: Consumer Protection (Amendment) Bill 2017: Discussion (2 Oct 2018)

Mary Butler: I understand that.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Jobs, Enterprise and Innovation: Consumer Protection (Amendment) Bill 2017: Discussion (2 Oct 2018)

Mary Butler: That was more out of interest than anything else. Has Deputy Rock anything to add?

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Jobs, Enterprise and Innovation: Consumer Protection (Amendment) Bill 2017: Discussion (2 Oct 2018)

Mary Butler: Last year or the year before, we heard much about people who bought gift vouchers for flights for different airlines. That did the rounds on some radio programmes. If a consumer had a voucher for €250 and the flight cost €212, they would never see that €38, or it is unlikely they would see it. It got a lot of traction.

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