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Select Committee on Housing, Planning and Local Government: Planning and Development Bill 2023: Committee Stage (Resumed) (18 Apr 2024)

Cian O'Callaghan: I am fine on amendment No. 955. Are we going to move to amendment No. 956?

Select Committee on Housing, Planning and Local Government: Planning and Development Bill 2023: Committee Stage (Resumed) (18 Apr 2024)

Cian O'Callaghan: The Cathaoirleach said he does not want to discuss costs, or can we do so on amendment No. 956?

Select Committee on Housing, Planning and Local Government: Planning and Development Bill 2023: Committee Stage (Resumed) (18 Apr 2024)

Cian O'Callaghan: Amendment No. 956 is related to costs and environmental matters.

Select Committee on Housing, Planning and Local Government: Planning and Development Bill 2023: Committee Stage (Resumed) (18 Apr 2024)

Cian O'Callaghan: There has been some discussion relevant to amendment No. 956 already and I appreciate there will be further discussion later. As the Minister of State will be aware, however, there have been many changes in costs over the years. One of the issues with the proposed changes is that, effectively, the State is going to have full control over the rates that are paid. That means the State will...

Select Committee on Housing, Planning and Local Government: Planning and Development Bill 2023: Committee Stage (Resumed) (18 Apr 2024)

Cian O'Callaghan: Yes.

Select Committee on Housing, Planning and Local Government: Planning and Development Bill 2023: Committee Stage (Resumed) (18 Apr 2024)

Cian O'Callaghan: Has the Minister of State no concerns about what he is proposing in terms of how this might affect the number of people who seek leave for judicial review? I am not saying the current system is perfect, but one of the issues around the current system, which I have seen myself, is that it allows for representatives to approach people for legal representation on the basis of a no foal, no fee...

Select Committee on Housing, Planning and Local Government: Planning and Development Bill 2023: Committee Stage (Resumed) (18 Apr 2024)

Cian O'Callaghan: Yes.

Select Committee on Housing, Planning and Local Government: Planning and Development Bill 2023: Committee Stage (Resumed) (18 Apr 2024)

Cian O'Callaghan: I would like to come in on this point.

Select Committee on Housing, Planning and Local Government: Planning and Development Bill 2023: Committee Stage (Resumed) (18 Apr 2024)

Cian O'Callaghan: We can take a break but I want to come back on amendment No. 956.

Select Committee on Housing, Planning and Local Government: Planning and Development Bill 2023: Committee Stage (Resumed) (18 Apr 2024)

Cian O'Callaghan: Sorry, I wanted to come in on amendment No. 956 and then we will move to amendment No. 979. Is the Minister of State saying of the scheme that will come in that if there is a change of Government, say there was one that was hostile to environmental NGOs, it could change the scheme and make it as difficult as possible for environmental NGOs? What is the situation?

Select Committee on Housing, Planning and Local Government: Planning and Development Bill 2023: Committee Stage (Resumed) (18 Apr 2024)

Cian O'Callaghan: The scheme will be set out in legislation, will it? How will it be done?

Select Committee on Housing, Planning and Local Government: Planning and Development Bill 2023: Committee Stage (Resumed) (18 Apr 2024)

Cian O'Callaghan: On the principles set out in the Bill on this, why is the language of Aarhus of not being prohibitively expensive being used in the Bill?

Select Committee on Housing, Planning and Local Government: Planning and Development Bill 2023: Committee Stage (Resumed) (18 Apr 2024)

Cian O'Callaghan: I know you do not have to use the specific language. I understand that. The Government can bring forward whatever wording it sees fit and it does not have to use that language but why is it not using that language? Does the Minister of State not share my concern that there could be a government or Minister who is hostile to the environment – it is not hard to imagine that this could...

Select Committee on Housing, Planning and Local Government: Planning and Development Bill 2023: Committee Stage (Resumed) (18 Apr 2024)

Cian O'Callaghan: I have a second question on this if the Minister of State wants to address that.

Select Committee on Housing, Planning and Local Government: Planning and Development Bill 2023: Committee Stage (Resumed) (18 Apr 2024)

Cian O'Callaghan: Okay. I thank the Minister of State.

Select Committee on Housing, Planning and Local Government: Planning and Development Bill 2023: Committee Stage (Resumed) (18 Apr 2024)

Cian O'Callaghan: Yes. The Minister of State just told me for a while that he would not use the language and then he told me that we have the language.

Select Committee on Housing, Planning and Local Government: Planning and Development Bill 2023: Committee Stage (Resumed) (18 Apr 2024)

Cian O'Callaghan: I have a second question. Say an environmental NGO is taking a case, for example, and the State is on the other side. The State is able to apportion whatever resources it wants to defend its side of the case. The State then, through this scheme, is able to dictate the resources available to the other applicant in the procedure. Is there not an imbalance here that the State can put as much...

Select Committee on Housing, Planning and Local Government: Planning and Development Bill 2023: Committee Stage (Resumed) (18 Apr 2024)

Cian O'Callaghan: The Minister of State is saying it should not be a problem that the State will be making a contribution to the costs. The current arrangement is not perfect but a no-foal, no-fee basis means applicants with a strong case can get access to strong legal representation, whereas the Minister of State is just talking about the State making a contribution towards costs. Some may have access to...

Select Committee on Housing, Planning and Local Government: Planning and Development Bill 2023: Committee Stage (Resumed) (18 Apr 2024)

Cian O'Callaghan: Is it the Minister of State's view that these changes will result in the taking of more judicial reviews?

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