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Public Accounts Committee: Financial Statements 2022: National Paediatric Hospital Development Board (30 May 2024)

Alan Kelly: The only money that can pay for that is the €500 million that has been awarded to the board. Otherwise it would not be trading properly.

Public Accounts Committee: Financial Statements 2022: National Paediatric Hospital Development Board (30 May 2024)

Alan Kelly: I take that as meaning some of that funding has to be used for that.

Public Accounts Committee: Financial Statements 2022: National Paediatric Hospital Development Board (30 May 2024)

Alan Kelly: I paraphrased.

Public Accounts Committee: Financial Statements 2022: National Paediatric Hospital Development Board (30 May 2024)

Alan Kelly: The additional €500 million? What is that for?

Public Accounts Committee: Financial Statements 2022: National Paediatric Hospital Development Board (30 May 2024)

Alan Kelly: Is it substantiated or acceptable to say none of that will go to the contractor?

Public Accounts Committee: Financial Statements 2022: National Paediatric Hospital Development Board (30 May 2024)

Alan Kelly: I just looked this up. This was covered in the media on 14 February. The Irish Times reported, “Mr Donnelly was adamant was that none of the funds [the €500 million] would go towards claims made by BAM.” I do not think that statement can be stood over. That is just absolute garbage. As a committee we should write to the Minister and tell him to withdraw this. He was...

Public Accounts Committee: Financial Statements 2022: National Paediatric Hospital Development Board (30 May 2024)

Alan Kelly: Exactly. I agree totally. I just wanted to make that point. I also believe we should write to CHI and get an update from it. Mr. Quinn said that some work, which I accept, would have been going on in parallel in respect of the six to nine months commissioning. We might get a status report from CHI on that. How many months has it cut off that nine months? That would be interesting. I...

Public Accounts Committee: Financial Statements 2022: National Paediatric Hospital Development Board (30 May 2024)

Alan Kelly: Just so the layman or laywoman among the public know, how many changes are required?

Public Accounts Committee: Financial Statements 2022: National Paediatric Hospital Development Board (30 May 2024)

Alan Kelly: It is just a figure that is needed.

Public Accounts Committee: Financial Statements 2022: National Paediatric Hospital Development Board (30 May 2024)

Alan Kelly: Okay, that is one.

Public Accounts Committee: Financial Statements 2022: National Paediatric Hospital Development Board (30 May 2024)

Alan Kelly: In total, how many changes have to be made?

Public Accounts Committee: Financial Statements 2022: National Paediatric Hospital Development Board (30 May 2024)

Alan Kelly: I asked a question. I apologise but I am caught for time. How many changes in total have to be made?

Public Accounts Committee: Financial Statements 2022: National Paediatric Hospital Development Board (30 May 2024)

Alan Kelly: Is it 2,000, 3,000-----

Public Accounts Committee: Financial Statements 2022: National Paediatric Hospital Development Board (30 May 2024)

Alan Kelly: Regarding light fittings, has there been any situation with that case or with others where the board made a decision - presumably the witnesses or Mr. Devine himself given his role - that it needed to go after a contractor or a subcontractor for its insurance because it was felt what was done did not meet the requirements or it was unhappy with it. Has the board ever bypassed the contractor...

Public Accounts Committee: Financial Statements 2022: National Paediatric Hospital Development Board (30 May 2024)

Alan Kelly: That is fine. I return to something that was said earlier on and regarding the whole employer representative, ER, side of things. I understand we have the figures but we need to give a health warning as regards ER, not related to the decisions but on the quantum. There is a huge number of claims that are outstanding. I think it is €600 and something odd million. I am only using...

Public Accounts Committee: Financial Statements 2022: National Paediatric Hospital Development Board (30 May 2024)

Alan Kelly: I look forward to discussing something like that again with Mr. Quinn. My colleague has very eloquently stated that the relationship between the contractor and the board is not - and I know it needs to be formal - on the friendliest of terms, for want of a better phrase. Has the Department, which is nearly like a referee itself, engaged any other formats, methodologies or people to try to...

Public Accounts Committee: Financial Statements 2022: National Paediatric Hospital Development Board (30 May 2024)

Alan Kelly: I know that. I used it as-----

Public Accounts Committee: Financial Statements 2022: National Paediatric Hospital Development Board (30 May 2024)

Alan Kelly: Okay. I apologise. I should not have used the word "referee". Has the Department used any other mechanisms outside of what we know about? Are there any other mechanisms, people or strategies the Department has used to try to see what is going on here?

Public Accounts Committee: Financial Statements 2022: National Paediatric Hospital Development Board (30 May 2024)

Alan Kelly: It is probably the wrong word.

Public Accounts Committee: Financial Statements 2022: National Paediatric Hospital Development Board (30 May 2024)

Alan Kelly: That is fair enough.

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