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Public Accounts Committee: 2019 Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 21 - Prisons
Chapter 7 – Catering and Ancillary Services in Prisons
(10 Dec 2020)

Marc MacSharry: This letter followed the Department's last appearance before the committee. I appreciate that there has been a change of personnel, but this is our first and only opportunity to ask this question. The letter from the then Secretary General said that one private company was paid €9,586.59 in 2011 and €8,641.68 in 2012. A second company was paid €10,774.12 in 2011. Ms...

Public Accounts Committee: 2019 Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 21 - Prisons
Chapter 7 – Catering and Ancillary Services in Prisons
(10 Dec 2020)

Marc MacSharry: I will put that in writing. I will conclude by saying that it is a matter of huge regret that my experience with at least two protected disclosures has shown that the system is designed to circle the wagons and the victims comes last.

Public Accounts Committee: 2019 Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 21 - Prisons
Chapter 7 – Catering and Ancillary Services in Prisons
(10 Dec 2020)

Marc MacSharry: That is a matter for Ms McPhillips. She controls what she says, I control what I say. To me, the evidence is clear. Stonewalling is permitted under the rules. We are asking pertinent questions that relate to victims.

Public Accounts Committee: 2019 Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 21 - Prisons
Chapter 7 – Catering and Ancillary Services in Prisons
(10 Dec 2020)

Marc MacSharry: Absolutely. They are in the public domain.

Public Accounts Committee: 2019 Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 21 - Prisons
Chapter 7 – Catering and Ancillary Services in Prisons
(10 Dec 2020)

Marc MacSharry: I am a messenger of the people, a Teachta Dála. I am not a protector of the system. I want to highlight things that are wrong with the system and help us weed them out if we can. Sadly, after 19 years my experience is that the system circles the wagons to the detriment of the victim on almost every occasion.

Public Accounts Committee: 2019 Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 21 - Prisons
Chapter 7 – Catering and Ancillary Services in Prisons
(10 Dec 2020)

Marc MacSharry: I have given my view.

Written Answers — Department of Health: Medicinal Products (10 Dec 2020)

Marc MacSharry: 373. To ask the Minister for Health the way in which he is encouraging the use of biosimilar medicines; and if he will make a statement on the matter. [42312/20]

Public Accounts Committee: 2019 Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 24 - Justice and Equality
(9 Dec 2020)

Marc MacSharry: I do not have questions at the moment. Tomorrow will be more my day in terms of preparation for questions.

Public Accounts Committee: 2019 Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 24 - Justice and Equality
(9 Dec 2020)

Marc MacSharry: I have one question because we have done most of the preparation for tomorrow. Is it correct that when a protected disclosure comes directly, for example, it is addressed to the Minister or Ms McPhillips, which is allowable under the 2015 Act?

Public Accounts Committee: 2019 Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 24 - Justice and Equality
(9 Dec 2020)

Marc MacSharry: The Department as the recipient would then send it for external review. Is that right?

Public Accounts Committee: 2019 Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 24 - Justice and Equality
(9 Dec 2020)

Marc MacSharry: Does the Department write the terms of reference for the external reviewer?

Public Accounts Committee: 2019 Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 24 - Justice and Equality
(9 Dec 2020)

Marc MacSharry: Are they given terms of reference?

Public Accounts Committee: 2019 Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 24 - Justice and Equality
(9 Dec 2020)

Marc MacSharry: By whom?

Public Accounts Committee: 2019 Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 24 - Justice and Equality
(9 Dec 2020)

Marc MacSharry: It is the same set of terms of reference.

Public Accounts Committee: 2019 Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 24 - Justice and Equality
(9 Dec 2020)

Marc MacSharry: The protected disclosure goes in and alleges whatever it alleges. We send it for an assessment to make sure it is a protected disclosure under the Act. Once that has been determined, it is sent to an external reviewer who is drawn from a panel. He or she operates the review to a set of terms of reference. What the witnesses are saying is that those terms of reference are uniform, be they...

Public Accounts Committee: 2019 Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 24 - Justice and Equality
(9 Dec 2020)

Marc MacSharry: Does it specifically exclude criminality? Does it stipulate that the external reviewer should not consider issues to do with criminality being alleged?

Public Accounts Committee: 2019 Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 24 - Justice and Equality
(9 Dec 2020)

Marc MacSharry: Could we check that for tomorrow? It is just that as part of my own research, I have come across the suggestion that a disclosure can go in, get assessed, be a disclosure and go out to the external reviewer with a set of terms of reference that preclude the reviewer from considering any matters to do with criminality.

Public Accounts Committee: 2019 Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 24 - Justice and Equality
(9 Dec 2020)

Marc MacSharry: I understand that. We do not want the reviewer to judge it, but if an external reviewer had a term of reference to exclude that, it might prevent the Department from referring that to An Garda Síochána after the fact, which is actually a condition of the Act. Is that not the case?

Public Accounts Committee: 2019 Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 24 - Justice and Equality
(9 Dec 2020)

Marc MacSharry: It is just that I have a particular protected disclosure in mind where I will be alleging tomorrow that this happened, so it would be useful if we had those details.

Public Accounts Committee (2 Dec 2020)

Marc MacSharry: I thank the Chairman for his apology, which I accept. Like Deputy Verona Murphy, I do not condone the content of the tweet, which was insensitive and inappropriate. It caused hurt to victims and descendants of victims and people who have a particular perspective. I respect and fully understand that. The Committee of Public Accounts is not the place for what some people are seeking,...

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