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Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Tracker Mortgages: Ulster Bank (1 Feb 2018)

Gerry Horkan: Mr. Stanley was trying to not come in today, 1 February, because of the closed period-----

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Tracker Mortgages: Ulster Bank (1 Feb 2018)

Gerry Horkan: -----or suggested he could not come in, even though every other bank was reasonably willing to come in during the same closed period. All the banks have very similar closed periods in that all of them have December year ends.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Tracker Mortgages: Ulster Bank (1 Feb 2018)

Gerry Horkan: As a result of our exchange this morning, it is clear why Mr. Stanley did not want to come in on 1 February. It is because it is hoped a lot more progress would be made by 1 March, 1 April or whenever he would come in again. Of all the banks we have heard from so far, and Mr. Stanley has acknowledged this, Ulster Bank is clearly the furthest behind.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Tracker Mortgages: Ulster Bank (1 Feb 2018)

Gerry Horkan: Is every account being examined? In terms of the difference between the 3,500 and the final number, are the only accounts being examined those that are with the Central Bank for robust discussion between Ulster Bank and the Central bank as to whether they are in or out?

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Tracker Mortgages: Ulster Bank (1 Feb 2018)

Gerry Horkan: Three hundred and ten thousand. We got that.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Tracker Mortgages: Ulster Bank (1 Feb 2018)

Gerry Horkan: All 1,600 of them or whatever it was.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Tracker Mortgages: Ulster Bank (1 Feb 2018)

Gerry Horkan: It is fair to say, therefore, that 3,500-----

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Tracker Mortgages: Ulster Bank (1 Feb 2018)

Gerry Horkan: -----are definitely confirmed and there is another potential percentage in terms of the other 3,500. Mr. Stanley expects the figure not to be as big as 3,500-----

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Tracker Mortgages: Ulster Bank (1 Feb 2018)

Gerry Horkan: -----but he will not say anything after that.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Tracker Mortgages: Ulster Bank (1 Feb 2018)

Gerry Horkan: It is difficult, therefore, for us to ask questions. I accept Mr. Stanley cannot talk about closed period matters but I am not asking about closed period matters. Mr. Stanley is here to talk about tracker mortgages-----

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Tracker Mortgages: Ulster Bank (1 Feb 2018)

Gerry Horkan: -----and it is very unfortunate that he is not willing to give us a bit more detail on the actual numbers.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Tracker Mortgages: Ulster Bank (1 Feb 2018)

Gerry Horkan: At the same time, Mr. Stanley has a provision in his accounts at 31 December 2016 of €211 million.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Tracker Mortgages: Ulster Bank (1 Feb 2018)

Gerry Horkan: Does he expect that to be sufficient to cover potentially up to 7,000 cases?

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Tracker Mortgages: Ulster Bank (1 Feb 2018)

Gerry Horkan: Mr. Stanley cannot tell us that.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Tracker Mortgages: Ulster Bank (1 Feb 2018)

Gerry Horkan: Touching on Senator Kieran O'Donnell's questions, the 1,214 people who have been paid out are the only people on which we can have absolute certainty in terms of the figures. Are the 2,396 who are not yet paid out tied down in that Ulster Bank knows the cost per customer of each of those ones?

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Tracker Mortgages: Ulster Bank (1 Feb 2018)

Gerry Horkan: No. On the difference between the 3,500 that are confirmed, 1,214 are paid out but 2,396 or thereabouts are not paid out. Of the 2,396 that are not paid out, is there certainty in Ulster Bank's books regarding the amounts that are payable to those people?

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Tracker Mortgages: Ulster Bank (1 Feb 2018)

Gerry Horkan: The averages mentioned in Appendix 1 for compensatory redress only relate to the 1,200 that are paid out-----

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Tracker Mortgages: Ulster Bank (1 Feb 2018)

Gerry Horkan: -----not the balance of 3,500?

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Tracker Mortgages: Ulster Bank (1 Feb 2018)

Gerry Horkan: We are still looking at only a very small percentage of what potentially is the impact on customers. I accept it probably will not be a full 7,000.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Tracker Mortgages: Ulster Bank (1 Feb 2018)

Gerry Horkan: It is somewhere between 3,500 and 7,000. We are looking at only 1,200. Mr. Stanley mentioned one case of loss of a home worth €300,000. Is that the highest-----

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