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Joint Oireachtas Committee on Health: New National Maternity Hospital: Discussion (Resumed) (12 May 2022)

Catherine Connolly: Okay. I thank Dr. Boylan. Then there is the co-location. I find it a source of frustration we are continually given the background of the importance of the hospital. That goes without saying. We were first to bring a motion before the Dáil to seek implementation of the national maternity strategy, which was not being implemented, further to a HIQA report that was condemnatory...

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Health: New National Maternity Hospital: Discussion (Resumed) (12 May 2022)

Catherine Connolly: Okay. The terminology around clinically permissible and legally permissible has been teased out so I am going to park that for a moment. Various things have been said about red herrings or misinformation. I have tried desperately to get all the information and make sense out of it, so I take issue with comments like that from various doctors, I might add, and various people. It is...

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Health: New National Maternity Hospital: Discussion (Resumed) (12 May 2022)

Catherine Connolly: It is correct. St. Vincent's Holdings is a new company to which the nuns gave their share and it is owned by three directors who are shareholders.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Health: New National Maternity Hospital: Discussion (Resumed) (12 May 2022)

Catherine Connolly: Okay, and we know nothing about how, in what manner or what conditions were attached to the Religious Sisters of Charity divesting its ownership of whatever it has given over. We know nothing about that, do we?

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Health: New National Maternity Hospital: Discussion (Resumed) (12 May 2022)

Catherine Connolly: That was a condition-----

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Health: New National Maternity Hospital: Discussion (Resumed) (12 May 2022)

Catherine Connolly: Okay. Thus, at some stage, and Dr. Boylan has mentioned it, the Religious Sisters of Charity said it was giving it as a gift.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Health: New National Maternity Hospital: Discussion (Resumed) (12 May 2022)

Catherine Connolly: That gift did not materialise-----

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Health: New National Maternity Hospital: Discussion (Resumed) (12 May 2022)

Catherine Connolly: -----but what did materialise was a transfer that was confirmed just two or three weeks ago where Religious Sisters of Charity has finally given over its share to St. Vincent's Holdings at the top of the pyramid.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Health: New National Maternity Hospital: Discussion (Resumed) (12 May 2022)

Catherine Connolly: St. Vincent's Holdings would have been enriched immeasurably by that transfer of land.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Health: New National Maternity Hospital: Discussion (Resumed) (12 May 2022)

Catherine Connolly: At the time, thanks to Dr. Boylan and other people, we got some insight into which aspects of Canon Law had to be complied with to allow for the transfer of the nuns' possession over St. Vincent's Holdings, but we have no clarity on that.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Health: New National Maternity Hospital: Discussion (Resumed) (12 May 2022)

Catherine Connolly: Dr. Boylan has already said it is important to get that documentation.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Health: New National Maternity Hospital: Discussion (Resumed) (12 May 2022)

Catherine Connolly: The Government tells us not to worry about that because we now have St. Vincent's Holdings with a new constitution, St. Vincent's Healthcare Group with a new constitution, and the national maternity hospital designated activity company with a constitution and because those three constitutions set out that there should be no concern about religious influence because the organisations have now...

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Health: New National Maternity Hospital: Discussion (Resumed) (12 May 2022)

Catherine Connolly: Let us take a different route in the few minutes I have left. The Religious Sisters of Charity could have decided to gift the site to the State.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Health: New National Maternity Hospital: Discussion (Resumed) (12 May 2022)

Catherine Connolly: That did not happen.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Health: New National Maternity Hospital: Discussion (Resumed) (12 May 2022)

Catherine Connolly: We do not know why it did not happen.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Health: New National Maternity Hospital: Discussion (Resumed) (12 May 2022)

Catherine Connolly: That is one possible interpretation, or they might have come to some arrangement with St. Vincent's Holdings or St. Vincent's Healthcare Group. We do not know.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Health: New National Maternity Hospital: Discussion (Resumed) (12 May 2022)

Catherine Connolly: It is vital to know that.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Health: New National Maternity Hospital: Discussion (Resumed) (12 May 2022)

Catherine Connolly: Here we are now with a secular St. Vincent's Healthcare Group. Does Dr. Boylan know at what point it became secular?

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Health: New National Maternity Hospital: Discussion (Resumed) (12 May 2022)

Catherine Connolly: It assures us in the documentation we all have that it is now secular. Well, I think one part of the documentation says it is evolving into a secular group, but lately we have heard it is a secular group. Dr. Boylan cannot help us as to when it became a secular group.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Health: New National Maternity Hospital: Discussion (Resumed) (12 May 2022)

Catherine Connolly: What would Dr. Boylan need to see to-----

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