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Public Accounts Committee: Business of Committee (27 Sep 2018)

Alan Kelly: It is unacceptable for the Department to take so long to respond on these two issues.

Public Accounts Committee: Business of Committee (27 Sep 2018)

Alan Kelly: We should note that the Department in question is the Department of Justice and Equality. In the light of previous replies on other issues in that Department over the past year, it needs to up its game very quickly under its new Secretary General.

Public Accounts Committee: Business of Committee (27 Sep 2018)

Alan Kelly: We are going to have to hold that over. There is nearly a meeting in that correspondence alone.

Public Accounts Committee: Business of Committee (27 Sep 2018)

Alan Kelly: There are an awful lot of issues there.

Public Accounts Committee: Business of Committee (27 Sep 2018)

Alan Kelly: CIT is the gift that keeps on giving. The president, Dr. O'Connor, had an opportunity to break from the past but we are going around in circles and it has been going on for years. Nothing has been learnt. Last year, the committee said governance was poor and risk management non-existent, and now CIT is trying to tell us again that there is nothing to see here. I could talk on this for...

Public Accounts Committee: Business of Committee (27 Sep 2018)

Alan Kelly: The new president was here the last time CIT was before us and he has had an opportunity to do something about it. We gave him that opportunity but this is more of the same. It is like being wrapped up in the same clothes again. What are we going to do? We cannot keep going on like this.

Public Accounts Committee: Business of Committee (27 Sep 2018)

Alan Kelly: There are further issues relating to the famous party and to multiple whistleblowers.

Public Accounts Committee: Business of Committee (27 Sep 2018)

Alan Kelly: They were here this year and last year. There was a big gang of them.

Public Accounts Committee: Business of Committee (27 Sep 2018)

Alan Kelly: That is about accurate.

Public Accounts Committee: Business of Committee (27 Sep 2018)

Alan Kelly: We will have to think about it for next week. I will leave it with a final comment. As a collective, we will have to come to some decision because it is insulting to keep having to go around in circles. We are getting nowhere. Everyone knows this has to go further but we cannot go any further with this type of correspondence. Where, as a committee, do we go next?

Public Accounts Committee: Business of Committee (27 Sep 2018)

Alan Kelly: There may be things to learn from Dr. Love's departure and the issues he raised in his resignation letter about the HEA and the Department. There are different interpretations in how this was conducted. We all know that the terms of reference, and the manner in which the investigation was done, was wrong. One cannot investigate oneself.

Public Accounts Committee: Business of Committee (27 Sep 2018)

Alan Kelly: It is helpful. I know the Teachers Union of Ireland, TUI, for instance, in the Cork branch has passed motions looking to recoup this money, including from the president. There has been much correspondence and commentary on it, and it is a welcome development. Having said that, we will see what happens. It is a small component of a bigger picture.

Public Accounts Committee: Business of Committee (27 Sep 2018)

Alan Kelly: I am somewhat concerned about when Dr. Love is leaving. We did not extend to October.

Public Accounts Committee: Business of Committee (27 Sep 2018)

Alan Kelly: No, I think the date is earlier.

Public Accounts Committee: Business of Committee (27 Sep 2018)

Alan Kelly: I think the committee will find the date is earlier.

Public Accounts Committee: Business of Committee (27 Sep 2018)

Alan Kelly: Now we are hurling. That is what I am talking about.

Public Accounts Committee: Business of Committee (27 Sep 2018)

Alan Kelly: It is important that we decide on our work programme.

Public Accounts Committee: Business of Committee (27 Sep 2018)

Alan Kelly: Is next week Teagasc?

Public Accounts Committee: Business of Committee (27 Sep 2018)

Alan Kelly: I wish to come in on this because I am aware of the details of this issue. Given the fact that it is their responsibility I ask that the Secretary General of that Department take this very seriously because there are quite considerable issues here and they are not just based around the individual who made the protected disclosure.

Public Accounts Committee: Business of Committee (27 Sep 2018)

Alan Kelly: I apologise for interrupting again. I also want it noted that the individual who is the subject of that protected disclosure should not have his terms and conditions of employment altered and no attempts to remove him from his position should be made. We as a committee would ask questions if that was done.

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