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Public Accounts Committee: Kildare and Wicklow Education and Training Board: Financial Statements 2015 (21 Feb 2019)

Seán Fleming: Yes. We will be discussing housing.

Public Accounts Committee: Kildare and Wicklow Education and Training Board: Financial Statements 2015 (21 Feb 2019)

Seán Fleming: We will cut to the chase. Can Mr. Ó Foghlú send the Department of Education and Skills' file in which it examines the ETB's case and gives approval? That is, will the Department send the committee the file containing both sides? We will conclude. The meeting will resume on the housing issue at 3.30 p.m. rather than 2.30 p.m. I have one question. There were various issues...

Public Accounts Committee: Kildare and Wicklow Education and Training Board: Financial Statements 2015 (21 Feb 2019)

Seán Fleming: I ask the ETB the same question, was there a loss either to the taxpayer or to the ETB?

Public Accounts Committee: Kildare and Wicklow Education and Training Board: Financial Statements 2015 (21 Feb 2019)

Seán Fleming: I ask the same question of the Department.

Public Accounts Committee: Kildare and Wicklow Education and Training Board: Financial Statements 2015 (21 Feb 2019)

Seán Fleming: What does that mean?

Public Accounts Committee: Kildare and Wicklow Education and Training Board: Financial Statements 2015 (21 Feb 2019)

Seán Fleming: But there are other non-procurement issues.

Public Accounts Committee: Kildare and Wicklow Education and Training Board: Financial Statements 2015 (21 Feb 2019)

Seán Fleming: The ETB, the Department of Education and Skills and the Comptroller and Auditor General are here about a big issue. I have asked the three organisations if there was a loss to the taxpayer and they are saying that maybe the Garda can answer that.

Public Accounts Committee: Kildare and Wicklow Education and Training Board: Financial Statements 2015 (21 Feb 2019)

Seán Fleming: That is interesting. The ETB, the Department of Education and Skills and the Comptroller and Auditor General are saying that they do not know if there is an actual loss. Nobody is saying there is a loss. I am just asking the question.

Public Accounts Committee: Kildare and Wicklow Education and Training Board: Financial Statements 2015 (21 Feb 2019)

Seán Fleming: So nobody can say whether there was a loss, if there was a loss, or state the quantum of the loss.

Public Accounts Committee: Kildare and Wicklow Education and Training Board: Financial Statements 2015 (21 Feb 2019)

Seán Fleming: Can I just ask the obvious question? Over 2015, 2016, 2017, 2018 and 2019, nobody has asked it.

Public Accounts Committee: Kildare and Wicklow Education and Training Board: Financial Statements 2015 (21 Feb 2019)

Seán Fleming: Who has been asked? What is the mechanism so far?

Public Accounts Committee: Kildare and Wicklow Education and Training Board: Financial Statements 2015 (21 Feb 2019)

Seán Fleming: In what years did the three big building projects arise?

Public Accounts Committee: Kildare and Wicklow Education and Training Board: Financial Statements 2015 (21 Feb 2019)

Seán Fleming: It is now 2019 and maybe in 2020 we might get an answer to this question about something that happened. It will be so historic. From the perspective of a Chairman of a Committee of Public Accounts, justice delayed is justice denied. The taxpayer will be denied if there is a loss. It has already taken six years and nobody has been able to put a figure on the loss, if there is a figure. In...

Public Accounts Committee: Kildare and Wicklow Education and Training Board: Financial Statements 2015 (21 Feb 2019)

Seán Fleming: More than frustrating. It is frustrating but not good enough that it has taken so long. I am not even talking about the old VEC, just this one. I will leave it at that. I thank the witnesses for attending. It is a difficult kind of meeting when there is a report that has gone to the Garda but I am satisfied the meeting was conducted properly. Nothing was said there that could compromise...

Public Accounts Committee: 2017 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 34 - Housing, Planning and Local Government
(21 Feb 2019)

Seán Fleming: We are dealing with matters relating to housing, planning and local government in respect of Vote 34 of the Appropriation Accounts. Before we proceed I wish to make one remark about our work programme. The Secretary General of the Department of Public Expenditure and Reform had written to us saying he was available for 7 March. We confirmed this morning that he will attend the meeting on...

Public Accounts Committee: 2017 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 34 - Housing, Planning and Local Government
(21 Feb 2019)

Seán Fleming: I thank Dr. Rhodes. I call Dr. McManus to give the opening statement on behalf of the Irish Council for Social Housing.

Public Accounts Committee: 2017 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 34 - Housing, Planning and Local Government
(21 Feb 2019)

Seán Fleming: I thank Dr. McManus. I call Deputy Cullinane.

Public Accounts Committee: 2017 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 34 - Housing, Planning and Local Government
(21 Feb 2019)

Seán Fleming: For the people watching, will Mr. Hannigan explain what he means by the "P and A agreement"?

Public Accounts Committee: 2017 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 34 - Housing, Planning and Local Government
(21 Feb 2019)

Seán Fleming: Will Mr. Hannigan explain what it is?

Public Accounts Committee: 2017 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 34 - Housing, Planning and Local Government
(21 Feb 2019)

Seán Fleming: Which organisation have they signed up with?

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