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Select Committee on Health: Nursing Homes Support Scheme (Amendment) Bill 2021: Committee Stage (30 Jun 2021)

Mary Butler: That person can apply from tomorrow or from when the scheme is enacted. He or she can appoint a successor and the time spent will count.

Select Committee on Health: Nursing Homes Support Scheme (Amendment) Bill 2021: Committee Stage (30 Jun 2021)

Mary Butler: Absolutely. It is from the time the successor is appointed that any time served will count. Even though the person had not taken a place under the fair deal scheme, he or she can start taking part in it from when the Bill is enacted or even from tomorrow. That time will count, categorically.

Select Committee on Health: Nursing Homes Support Scheme (Amendment) Bill 2021: Committee Stage (30 Jun 2021)

Mary Butler: I would like to work with the Deputies on this amendment. The new legislation provision mirrors section 24 of the principal Act, in terms of notification of material change in circumstance of persons provided with financial support. In this section, as Deputy Naugten said, the time span allowed is ten working days, which is two weeks. This section has not caused any problems for the HSE...

Select Committee on Health: Nursing Homes Support Scheme (Amendment) Bill 2021: Committee Stage (30 Jun 2021)

Mary Butler: Once they notify the scheme within those 20 working days, they have six months to establish what needs to be done. Once they make a notification within the 20 working days, there is a six-month timeframe available to sort out the issues.

Select Committee on Health: Nursing Homes Support Scheme (Amendment) Bill 2021: Committee Stage (30 Jun 2021)

Mary Butler: We will certainly give it consideration.

Select Committee on Health: Nursing Homes Support Scheme (Amendment) Bill 2021: Committee Stage (30 Jun 2021)

Mary Butler: I wish to table an amendment on Report Stage.

Select Committee on Health: Nursing Homes Support Scheme (Amendment) Bill 2021: Committee Stage (30 Jun 2021)

Mary Butler: Yes. I will give the committee a little bit of information. On Report Stage, a technical amendment will be required to section 19 of the Bill which amends section 29 of the 2009 Act. This section concerns when a charging order is placed in the context of ancillary State support on an asset under joint ownership. Section 29 has been updated to take into account the chartered provisions...

Select Committee on Health: Nursing Homes Support Scheme (Amendment) Bill 2021: Committee Stage (30 Jun 2021)

Mary Butler: There are a number of inheritance scenarios which need be described and accounted for in the Bill, depending on the ownership model of assets that both members of a couple have an interest in. The goal at all times is to ensure fairness for the couple. To be clear, the Bill refers to a daughter or son who is married and takes into account people who have partners, which is very important in...

Select Committee on Health: Nursing Homes Support Scheme (Amendment) Bill 2021: Committee Stage (30 Jun 2021)

Mary Butler: I wish to flag that I will be bringing an amendment forward at Report Stage. This section amends section 36 of the principal Act and allows the Minister, in respect of any difficulty which arises during the period of three years from the commencement of the Act of 2021, by regulations to do anything which appears to be necessary or expedient for bringing the amendments in the Act into...

Select Committee on Health: Nursing Homes Support Scheme (Amendment) Bill 2021: Committee Stage (30 Jun 2021)

Mary Butler: Deputy Denis Naughten’s amendment was ruled out of order by the Bills Office. I did not have any part in that. I will address some of the Deputy's points and then will speak in general regarding Deputy Shortall’s amendment, which will allow me to address almost all of the points that have been made. When an asset includes an inherent and-or sale value and generates an income,...

Select Committee on Health: Nursing Homes Support Scheme (Amendment) Bill 2021: Committee Stage (30 Jun 2021)

Mary Butler: Can the Chairman hear me?

Select Committee on Health: Nursing Homes Support Scheme (Amendment) Bill 2021: Committee Stage (30 Jun 2021)

Mary Butler: We are giving every consideration to Deputy O'Dea's Bill and have been interacting with him regarding approved housing bodies and rental. We are looking at every aspect of this issue. We need creative thinking to see how this can happen. I do not accept that 150,000 homes could be locked out of the housing market. There are 21,000 people in the scheme. When someone ticks the box...

Select Committee on Health: Nursing Homes Support Scheme (Amendment) Bill 2021: Committee Stage (30 Jun 2021)

Mary Butler: I will come back to the Deputy on a number of points. As long as I am Minister of State with responsibility for older people, the two key words are "voice" and "choice" and their voices and choices will be heard. That is the first point. The second is that we are working really hard to try to see how we can get the creative thinking in place on an extremely complex issue that was not...

Select Committee on Health: Nursing Homes Support Scheme (Amendment) Bill 2021: Committee Stage (30 Jun 2021)

Mary Butler: In fairness, we all want the same thing. We all want to get people into empty houses. That is the most important thing. When we were working with the Department, it had two asks of us. One was that the cap would be included at three years on the sale of a house. That is done. The second part is much more complex. I take on board that Deputy Shortall asked that we come forward within...

Select Committee on Health: Nursing Homes Support Scheme (Amendment) Bill 2021: Committee Stage (30 Jun 2021)

Mary Butler: I wish to flag that this is the amendment I want to bring forward on Report Stage. This section repeals existing provisions within the principal Act pertaining to the availability of a three-year cap to owners of farm or business assets who require nursing home care as a result of sudden illness or disability. The section adds additional provisions to paragraph 6 of Part 3 of Schedule 1 to...

Select Committee on Health: Nursing Homes Support Scheme (Amendment) Bill 2021: Committee Stage (30 Jun 2021)

Mary Butler: I will speak to it if that is okay. This proposed amendment provides that the Bill is brought into operation no more than 30 days after it is enacted. My firm intention is that this legislation amendment is enacted and commenced as quickly as possible. A number of matters need to be considered carefully before this can happen, however. The changes to the scheme are complex and significant...

Select Committee on Health: Nursing Homes Support Scheme (Amendment) Bill 2021: Committee Stage (30 Jun 2021)

Mary Butler: I thank the Deputy for withdrawing the amendment. I will bring forward an amendment on Report Stage, which is expected to be taken on either 13 or 14 July. I thank the Deputy for his co-operation.

Select Committee on Health: Nursing Homes Support Scheme (Amendment) Bill 2021: Committee Stage (30 Jun 2021)

Mary Butler: I wish to confirm that, as flagged during the debate, I will be bringing forward several amendments on Report Stage.

Select Committee on Health: Nursing Homes Support Scheme (Amendment) Bill 2021: Committee Stage (30 Jun 2021)

Mary Butler: Yes.

Select Committee on Health: Nursing Homes Support Scheme (Amendment) Bill 2021: Committee Stage (30 Jun 2021)

Mary Butler: I thank members for their time. I wish to raise one final point. A technical amendment is to be made to section 47 of the principal Act. That will also be done on Report Stage. The details will be available then. I thank the Chairman and the members for their co-operation. It is great to complete Committee Stage within the time constraints of two hours. I thank all members for their...

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