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Joint Oireachtas Committee on Health: General Scheme of the Public Health (Tobacco and Nicotine Inhaling Products) Bill 2019: Discussion (Resumed) (15 Feb 2022)

David Cullinane: The witnesses are welcome. I approach this issue through the lens of public health. If I have a bias, it is that I always examine such issues as this through the lens of what is good for public health. The Irish Cancer Society and Irish Heart Foundation were before the committee. I assume Mr. Connolly has read their materials and heard some of the debate and the questions that were put....

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Health: General Scheme of the Public Health (Tobacco and Nicotine Inhaling Products) Bill 2019: Discussion (Resumed) (15 Feb 2022)

David Cullinane: I will test a number of things in Mr. Connolly's opening statement. He said his organisation's members are helping Irish smokers become smoke-free on a daily basis. I will test that against some of the reports, submissions and data we got from the Irish Cancer Society. Did Mr. Connolly see the MRBI poll results that came from the Irish Cancer Society? Has he studied them?

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Health: General Scheme of the Public Health (Tobacco and Nicotine Inhaling Products) Bill 2019: Discussion (Resumed) (15 Feb 2022)

David Cullinane: As an organisation advocating for its members, it would have been good to see that report. It is a substantial poll that looks at people's attitudes. One result was that the Irish public concur with the evidence on flavouring and advertising. Teenagers say in focus group interviews that fewer young people would use e-cigarettes if fruity, sweet, minty or dessert flavours were not...

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Health: General Scheme of the Public Health (Tobacco and Nicotine Inhaling Products) Bill 2019: Discussion (Resumed) (15 Feb 2022)

David Cullinane: There may well be unintended consequences but the intended consequence is that we do not have more young people becoming dependent on vaping products or cigarettes. That is how I approach it as a public representative. I move to some other evidence. The Health Research Board in October 2020 published a report. It found that adolescents who had used an e-cigarette were between three and...

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Health: General Scheme of the Public Health (Tobacco and Nicotine Inhaling Products) Bill 2019: Discussion (Resumed) (15 Feb 2022)

David Cullinane: Does he agree with it?

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Health: General Scheme of the Public Health (Tobacco and Nicotine Inhaling Products) Bill 2019: Discussion (Resumed) (15 Feb 2022)

David Cullinane: I have many reports. We can go through all of the data.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Health: General Scheme of the Public Health (Tobacco and Nicotine Inhaling Products) Bill 2019: Discussion (Resumed) (15 Feb 2022)

David Cullinane: The answer is "No", is it? Mr. Connolly does not agree with that part of it?

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Health: General Scheme of the Public Health (Tobacco and Nicotine Inhaling Products) Bill 2019: Discussion (Resumed) (15 Feb 2022)

David Cullinane: Okay. It also says the research shows dual use of e-cigarettes and conventional cigarettes is not less harmful than smoking conventional cigarettes alone. Does Mr. Connolly agree with that?

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Health: General Scheme of the Public Health (Tobacco and Nicotine Inhaling Products) Bill 2019: Discussion (Resumed) (15 Feb 2022)

David Cullinane: The report highlights that this raises questions about the smoking reduction benefit of e-cigarettes. In Mr. Connolly's opening statement he stated that the IVVA help Irish smokers become smoke-free on a daily basis. I juxtapose that with the research I am reading. Though Mr. Connolly quoted other research in his opening statement, the research coming from the European Union and research...

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Health: General Scheme of the Public Health (Tobacco and Nicotine Inhaling Products) Bill 2019: Discussion (Resumed) (15 Feb 2022)

David Cullinane: Unless Mr. Connolly can point it out to me, I doubt that Healthy Ireland in any of its statements said that IVVA members help Irish smokers become smoke-free on a daily basis. I doubt that you could take that interpretation from its statements.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Health: General Scheme of the Public Health (Tobacco and Nicotine Inhaling Products) Bill 2019: Discussion (Resumed) (15 Feb 2022)

David Cullinane: We will ask Healthy Ireland what its view is and we will-----

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Health: General Scheme of the Public Health (Tobacco and Nicotine Inhaling Products) Bill 2019: Discussion (Resumed) (15 Feb 2022)

David Cullinane: You can take information from a report that does not reflect the authors' overall position on an issue. It would be worthwhile to get its position. I will move on to another report. It comes from the European Commission's Scientific Committee on Health and Environmental Risks, SCHEER. It issued an opinion on electronic cigarettes in which it found moderate evidence that e-cigarettes are...

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Health: General Scheme of the Public Health (Tobacco and Nicotine Inhaling Products) Bill 2019: Discussion (Resumed) (15 Feb 2022)

David Cullinane: The committee's report is wrong in saying that there is moderate evidence.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Health: General Scheme of the Public Health (Tobacco and Nicotine Inhaling Products) Bill 2019: Discussion (Resumed) (15 Feb 2022)

David Cullinane: Disturbingly, the report also states that SCHEER found consistent evidence that flavours attract young people to e-cigarettes. I believe Mr. Connolly has accepted that, has he not?

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Health: General Scheme of the Public Health (Tobacco and Nicotine Inhaling Products) Bill 2019: Discussion (Resumed) (15 Feb 2022)

David Cullinane: Does he agree to a certain extent or does he agree?

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Health: General Scheme of the Public Health (Tobacco and Nicotine Inhaling Products) Bill 2019: Discussion (Resumed) (15 Feb 2022)

David Cullinane: The report actually goes further. When it talks about flavours, it states that SCHEER found consistent evidence that flavours attract youth to e-cigarettes. It also found that: "Flavours decrease harm perceptions and increase willingness to try and initiate use of electronic cigarettes." It is quite clear and explicit.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Health: General Scheme of the Public Health (Tobacco and Nicotine Inhaling Products) Bill 2019: Discussion (Resumed) (15 Feb 2022)

David Cullinane: I will put two final questions to Mr. Connolly. In his opening statement, he indicated that, based on a report from Euromonitor, the spend on e-cigarettes was almost €70 million in 2018, with the Exchequer receiving 23% VAT on all sales. It may well be the case that there is revenue accruing from these products but I am not sure that is a strong selling point. Back in the 1970s and...

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Health: General Scheme of the Public Health (Tobacco and Nicotine Inhaling Products) Bill 2019: Discussion (Resumed) (15 Feb 2022)

David Cullinane: They also called for a statutory ban on "all e-cigarette product advertising through all communication mediums, including outdoor areas (billboards, buses), at point of sale and online". Does Mr. Connolly support that?

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Health: General Scheme of the Public Health (Tobacco and Nicotine Inhaling Products) Bill 2019: Discussion (Resumed) (15 Feb 2022)

David Cullinane: So, that is one area in respect of which Mr. Connolly does agree.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Health: General Scheme of the Public Health (Tobacco and Nicotine Inhaling Products) Bill 2019: Discussion (Resumed) (15 Feb 2022)

David Cullinane: They also want a prohibition on the use of vending machines to sell tobacco products to be included in the Bill. The recommendation Mr. Connolly does not agree with is the one regarding flavouring. That is the point of difference.

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