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Joint Oireachtas Committee on Housing, Planning and Local Government: Draft River Basin Management Plan for Ireland 2022-2027: Discussion (7 Apr 2022)

Steven Matthews: That is what I remember. It was a lot sooner than 2027, anyway.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Housing, Planning and Local Government: Draft River Basin Management Plan for Ireland 2022-2027: Discussion (7 Apr 2022)

Steven Matthews: Yes.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Housing, Planning and Local Government: Draft River Basin Management Plan for Ireland 2022-2027: Discussion (7 Apr 2022)

Steven Matthews: Are we going to be looking for a derogation on the water framework directive similar to our derogations on the nitrates directive? Furthermore, where are we on the European league table when it comes to compliance with the nitrates directive or the water framework directive? They are European directives and it is important we benchmark ourselves against those performing the best and see how...

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Housing, Planning and Local Government: Draft River Basin Management Plan for Ireland 2022-2027: Discussion (7 Apr 2022)

Steven Matthews: Yes. Dr. McGoff and Ms O'Brien are indicating.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Housing, Planning and Local Government: Draft River Basin Management Plan for Ireland 2022-2027: Discussion (7 Apr 2022)

Steven Matthews: I thank Dr. McGoff. I will go to Ms O'Brien and then come back to Mr. Burgess.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Housing, Planning and Local Government: Draft River Basin Management Plan for Ireland 2022-2027: Discussion (7 Apr 2022)

Steven Matthews: Does Mr. Burgess see a point when we will not need derogations on the nitrates directive?

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Housing, Planning and Local Government: Draft River Basin Management Plan for Ireland 2022-2027: Discussion (7 Apr 2022)

Steven Matthews: If you take water quality, climate emissions and everything, does Mr. Burgess see a switch in the situation where the stocking rate would meet that as set out?

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Housing, Planning and Local Government: Draft River Basin Management Plan for Ireland 2022-2027: Discussion (7 Apr 2022)

Steven Matthews: That depends on the soil type, the slope and the location.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Housing, Planning and Local Government: Draft River Basin Management Plan for Ireland 2022-2027: Discussion (7 Apr 2022)

Steven Matthews: An Taisce might have mentioned forestry in its submission. I ask the witnesses to expand on the legacy forestry issues we have. Many of our forestry issues go back 25 or 30 years or more. How would An Taisce deal with those situations now? Is our forestry going in the right direction? Did An Taisce mention that in its submission?

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Housing, Planning and Local Government: Draft River Basin Management Plan for Ireland 2022-2027: Discussion (7 Apr 2022)

Steven Matthews: I would agree with Dr. Crowe. We probably did not do it right over the years. That is why it is a negative thing.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Housing, Planning and Local Government: Draft River Basin Management Plan for Ireland 2022-2027: Discussion (7 Apr 2022)

Steven Matthews: We definitely did not do it right. There is a massive reduction in the pristine water category. Was it An Taisce or SWAN that detailed this in its submission?

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Housing, Planning and Local Government: Draft River Basin Management Plan for Ireland 2022-2027: Discussion (7 Apr 2022)

Steven Matthews: From a figure of how many?

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Housing, Planning and Local Government: Draft River Basin Management Plan for Ireland 2022-2027: Discussion (7 Apr 2022)

Steven Matthews: What are the main reasons that we have gone from 500 to 20? We have heard that forestry is one of them so has analysis been done on that?

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Housing, Planning and Local Government: Draft River Basin Management Plan for Ireland 2022-2027: Discussion (7 Apr 2022)

Steven Matthews: There is a question in the An Taisce submission I am interested in and that was not answered. The submission states: Teagasc were asked to do some modelling of various scenarios to inform policy decisions to reduce nitrate runoff from agriculture [This is "The Impact of Nitrogen Management Strategies within Grass Based Dairy Systems"]. One of the main drivers identified was that cattle...

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Housing, Planning and Local Government: Draft River Basin Management Plan for Ireland 2022-2027: Discussion (7 Apr 2022)

Steven Matthews: Okay, I accept that. To clarify, that was a question submitted by An Taisce that I find interesting. If Dr. O'Mara does not have that data, I will not put him on the spot and ask for them. An interesting question has been raised, however. If Dr. O'Mara wants to give us a written submission, I would be happy with that or he may want to have a stab at it now.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Housing, Planning and Local Government: Draft River Basin Management Plan for Ireland 2022-2027: Discussion (7 Apr 2022)

Steven Matthews: Okay. I thank Mr. Burgess. I thought that was an interesting question to ask. We got quite a lot of questions on agriculture but the other main sources, obviously, are wastewater treatment plants and discharges to rivers or lakes. There was a suggestion that Irish Water should clearly itemise the mediation measures that are required across the entire system. Who made that submission?

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Housing, Planning and Local Government: Draft River Basin Management Plan for Ireland 2022-2027: Discussion (7 Apr 2022)

Steven Matthews: Is it just that Ms O'Brien feels that Irish Water, prior to which it would have been the local authorities, has not itemised clearly enough or put a costing on all those works that need to be done to bring it back? To me, point source pollution is really an investment issue.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Housing, Planning and Local Government: Draft River Basin Management Plan for Ireland 2022-2027: Discussion (7 Apr 2022)

Steven Matthews: I thank Ms O'Brien. My final question kind of goes back to bringing the public along with us. We have to bring everyone along in everything we do, whether it is agriculture, industry or individual users or residents. I read the latest EPA publication, that is, its indicators report from 2020. I find some of the graphs and charts confusing as well. I try to work out if where we see a drop...

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Housing, Planning and Local Government: Draft River Basin Management Plan for Ireland 2022-2027: Discussion (7 Apr 2022)

Steven Matthews: Hopefully so. Maybe water will be the main issue as climate was in discussions ten to 20 years ago. I do not think we should have to wait ten or 15 years for it to become the main issue.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Housing, Planning and Local Government: Draft River Basin Management Plan for Ireland 2022-2027: Discussion (7 Apr 2022)

Steven Matthews: I thank Dr. O'Mara. All of the witnesses made important points. Nobody wants to damage or pollute water supplies. We are all aware that it is finite and precious. We rely on it. It is a staple of human life, with everything that goes with it. Dr. Crowe talked about a collaborative approach and I entirely agree. It is the same approach needed to address climate. We cannot say it is the...

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