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Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: A Future Framework for Accountability in the Banking Sector: Discussion (12 Mar 2019)

John McGuinness: I will give Mr. Crowley a spread. The federation said nothing during the crisis. I looked over the things that were said during the crisis and the banking federation said nothing. No one within the banking sector cried stop. No one said that, although the banks were paying their membership fees, they were going off the rails a bit. I did not hear that. We will put that to one side...

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: A Future Framework for Accountability in the Banking Sector: Discussion (12 Mar 2019)

John McGuinness: These may be uncomfortable facts. I am not putting any onus on Mr. Crowley or saying that it is his fault. I am asking him if, within that tough banking sector, someone would introduce a conversation about those involved conducting themselves properly, whether in the courts, directly in repossessions, or in a one-to-one with individual customers. We are talking about changing the banking...

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: A Future Framework for Accountability in the Banking Sector: Discussion (12 Mar 2019)

John McGuinness: I am asking Mr. Crowley to take into consideration that, from my experience with the banks, and more recently with the very public experience that we had on the tracker mortgage issue, that the old culture in the bank is alive and well. Dogs resemble their masters, as they say. In any business, the master should be telling the next person down that this has to change. That seeps out to...

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: A Future Framework for Accountability in the Banking Sector: Discussion (12 Mar 2019)

John McGuinness: I ask Mr. Crowley not to be afraid to kick the asses of the federation's members if they are not doing things right. Brian Cody does it all the time in the case of the Kilkenny team. I thank Mr. Crowley for his appearance.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: A Future Framework for Accountability in the Banking Sector: Discussion (12 Mar 2019)

John McGuinness: I welcome Mr. Tobin, Mr. Dorgan, Ms Cotter and Ms Curtin to the meeting. I have already read out the notice on privilege and I am sure the witnesses have heard it before. We take note of that.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: A Future Framework for Accountability in the Banking Sector: Discussion (12 Mar 2019)

John McGuinness: The Senator will need to have a chat with the Minister for Finance.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: A Future Framework for Accountability in the Banking Sector: Discussion (12 Mar 2019)

John McGuinness: I have a few questions on the proposed Central Bank (amendment) Bill. Has the Department been lobbied on it by any organisation? How does lobbying occur? Is it through the Minister's office or officials? Banking and Payments Federation Ireland, BPFI, has said that it has lobbied.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: A Future Framework for Accountability in the Banking Sector: Discussion (12 Mar 2019)

John McGuinness: But the Department has had no-----

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: A Future Framework for Accountability in the Banking Sector: Discussion (12 Mar 2019)

John McGuinness: Mr. Tobin stated in his opening remarks that it was about regulated services. Is there any way of ensuring that those that are not regulated meet some standard? The Central Bank (amendment) Bill is an opportunity to deal with the many issues that have arisen. One of the major issues is the behaviour of vulture funds and non-regulated entities. Can protocols on what sorts of practice are...

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: A Future Framework for Accountability in the Banking Sector: Discussion (12 Mar 2019)

John McGuinness: They are covered by these regulations.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: A Future Framework for Accountability in the Banking Sector: Discussion (12 Mar 2019)

John McGuinness: Due to Deputy Michael McGrath's legislation, the regulated services under that heading will be considered as regulated entities as far as this Bill is concerned.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: A Future Framework for Accountability in the Banking Sector: Discussion (12 Mar 2019)

John McGuinness: Mr. Tobin can use the term "charities" if he wishes, since some of them have charities. I doubt that many people would believe him, but go on.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: A Future Framework for Accountability in the Banking Sector: Discussion (12 Mar 2019)

John McGuinness: It was mentioned that some aspects of Deputy Pearse Doherty's Bill would be taken on board.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: A Future Framework for Accountability in the Banking Sector: Discussion (12 Mar 2019)

John McGuinness: The Department will be taking on aspects of it.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: A Future Framework for Accountability in the Banking Sector: Discussion (12 Mar 2019)

John McGuinness: The matter of whistleblowers was mentioned. When Mr. Jonathan Sugarman appeared before us, he told a compelling story and outlined what he did. When we questioned the Central Bank, it told us that it could not tell us whether a sanction had been applied to the bank in question or whether there had been any fine. Under legislation it was not permitted to say. However, when credit unions...

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: A Future Framework for Accountability in the Banking Sector: Discussion (12 Mar 2019)

John McGuinness: In respect of credit unions.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: A Future Framework for Accountability in the Banking Sector: Discussion (12 Mar 2019)

John McGuinness: Then why is it that the Central Bank could not state whether it had sanctioned or fined banks?

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: A Future Framework for Accountability in the Banking Sector: Discussion (12 Mar 2019)

John McGuinness: Is it possible that the Department would reconsider that stance in the proposed Central Bank (Amendment) Bill and include a name and shame section?

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: A Future Framework for Accountability in the Banking Sector: Discussion (12 Mar 2019)

John McGuinness: Yes.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: A Future Framework for Accountability in the Banking Sector: Discussion (12 Mar 2019)

John McGuinness: The delegates should. I do not see why there should be an exemption or any sanction should be a secret. If a bank has done wrong-----

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