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Public Accounts Committee: Appropriation Accounts 2021
Vote 24 – Justice
(25 May 2023)

Brian Stanley: I know that. We do not want a hard border.

Public Accounts Committee: Appropriation Accounts 2021
Vote 24 – Justice
(25 May 2023)

Brian Stanley: I am just trying to understand how it works.

Public Accounts Committee: Appropriation Accounts 2021
Vote 24 – Justice
(25 May 2023)

Brian Stanley: I know. I do not expect Ms McPhillips to do so. I am just trying to understand how the system works. The point where people come to the immigration centre and are fingerprinted, etc., is really the checkpoint after which one can start to process.

Public Accounts Committee: Appropriation Accounts 2021
Vote 24 – Justice
(25 May 2023)

Brian Stanley: I wanted to figure out how it works. Is the Department making a concerted effort for those who are awaiting a decision for three, four or five years, even though it might be a second-round decision? If people have a genuine case, it is important that we try to help them. The increase in staff is to be welcomed. We have highlighted this. It will more than double the current figures. When...

Public Accounts Committee: Appropriation Accounts 2021
Vote 24 – Justice
(25 May 2023)

Brian Stanley: Is that realistic?

Public Accounts Committee: Appropriation Accounts 2021
Vote 24 – Justice
(25 May 2023)

Brian Stanley: Is it the case that the Department has approximately 300 staff at present?

Public Accounts Committee: Appropriation Accounts 2021
Vote 24 – Justice
(25 May 2023)

Brian Stanley: Deputy, please treat the witness with respect.

Public Accounts Committee: Appropriation Accounts 2021
Vote 24 – Justice
(25 May 2023)

Brian Stanley: Deputy-----

Public Accounts Committee: Appropriation Accounts 2021
Vote 24 – Justice
(25 May 2023)

Brian Stanley: Be careful, Deputy. You are dealing with specific cases.

Public Accounts Committee: Appropriation Accounts 2021
Vote 24 – Justice
(25 May 2023)

Brian Stanley: Deputy, you might let in the witness.

Public Accounts Committee: Appropriation Accounts 2021
Vote 24 – Justice
(25 May 2023)

Brian Stanley: Or any cases in a general way.

Public Accounts Committee: Appropriation Accounts 2021
Vote 24 – Justice
(25 May 2023)

Brian Stanley: I ask the Deputy not to be specific.

Public Accounts Committee: Appropriation Accounts 2021
Vote 24 – Justice
(25 May 2023)

Brian Stanley: A quick question, Deputy.

Public Accounts Committee: Appropriation Accounts 2021
Vote 24 – Justice
(25 May 2023)

Brian Stanley: I ask the Deputy to be careful about being specific. She may continue but briefly.

Public Accounts Committee: Appropriation Accounts 2021
Vote 24 – Justice
(25 May 2023)

Brian Stanley: I thank Ms McPhillips. Where red flags are raised or a senior official in the Department does not get answers to correspondence on a particular scheme, and I am not mentioning any scheme, why would that scheme be allowed to continue and to take in another huge number of investments? Why would that happen?

Public Accounts Committee: Appropriation Accounts 2021
Vote 24 – Justice
(25 May 2023)

Brian Stanley: Let me present a scenario in which there is a scheme where the money does not materialise or is outside the State and people who invested €1 million, €2 million or €3 million in the scheme are given status and residency on the basis of that investment. Let us say a number of people invested €20 million in the scheme and this is never invested in the project in...

Public Accounts Committee: Appropriation Accounts 2021
Vote 24 – Justice
(25 May 2023)

Brian Stanley: What I am trying to figure out is that when these things happen with a particular agent or investor, normally the first thing that would be done is-----

Public Accounts Committee: Appropriation Accounts 2021
Vote 24 – Justice
(25 May 2023)

Brian Stanley: Even before consequences, someone would press the pause button and would not allow the hole to get any deeper. I will be non-specific but what I am trying to figure out for the committee - I think it is what Deputy Munster was trying to figure out - is why, in such a circumstance, a scheme would be allowed to continue and to take in further investments from a number of other individuals?

Public Accounts Committee: Appropriation Accounts 2021
Vote 24 – Justice
(25 May 2023)

Brian Stanley: Where there is an agent-----

Public Accounts Committee: Appropriation Accounts 2021
Vote 24 – Justice
(25 May 2023)

Brian Stanley: If a project was allowed to continue with the same agent and people were still investing in it, obviously those people would be in a situation in which they are being misled. If, in a hypothetical situation like that, the investor does not respond to the Department's senior officials, there is no information on where, we will say, the first €20 million went, another €30 million...

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