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Joint Oireachtas Committee on Housing, Planning and Local Government: Issues Relating to Quarries and Deleterious Materials: Discussion (6 Dec 2022)

Steven Matthews: To be clear, was it the production control process with which with the NSAI had an issue?

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Housing, Planning and Local Government: Issues Relating to Quarries and Deleterious Materials: Discussion (6 Dec 2022)

Steven Matthews: In such instances, will the NSAI contact the Department to say it questions the conformity of the production control process of one of the producers that sends it results and, therefore, that the product coming out at the end may not meet the standard?

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Housing, Planning and Local Government: Issues Relating to Quarries and Deleterious Materials: Discussion (6 Dec 2022)

Steven Matthews: The issue is flagged with the Department. What steps does the Department take after receiving that notification and what is the timeframe involved?

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Housing, Planning and Local Government: Issues Relating to Quarries and Deleterious Materials: Discussion (6 Dec 2022)

Steven Matthews: That is understandable. Do the NSAI and the Department have concerns that the concrete blocks made by this producer are not up to standard, or is it just that the process in place at the moment is being questioned? Has the product been tested fully?

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Housing, Planning and Local Government: Issues Relating to Quarries and Deleterious Materials: Discussion (6 Dec 2022)

Steven Matthews: What happened then? Was the company told it must modify its control process and it would then get back its certificate of conformity? Is that how it works?

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Housing, Planning and Local Government: Issues Relating to Quarries and Deleterious Materials: Discussion (6 Dec 2022)

Steven Matthews: From how many entities producing concrete products does the NSAI receive control or audit documentation showing proof they are in compliance? How many such companies are in operation?

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Housing, Planning and Local Government: Issues Relating to Quarries and Deleterious Materials: Discussion (6 Dec 2022)

Steven Matthews: Will Mr. Balfe explain what he means by that?

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Housing, Planning and Local Government: Issues Relating to Quarries and Deleterious Materials: Discussion (6 Dec 2022)

Steven Matthews: Mr. Balfe indicated that the NSAI certifies 168 quarries and 95 concrete product manufacturers.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Housing, Planning and Local Government: Issues Relating to Quarries and Deleterious Materials: Discussion (6 Dec 2022)

Steven Matthews: Mr. Balfe said the NSAI is not the only notifying body. Does he know the total number of such bodies in the State? Do they follow a different process but with the same audit?

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Housing, Planning and Local Government: Issues Relating to Quarries and Deleterious Materials: Discussion (6 Dec 2022)

Steven Matthews: I am finding this quite complex. I do not know whether anybody else is finding the same. I will have a think about it and may come back with further questions. Senator Fitzpatrick referred to SI 365 of 2015, which provides for an opt-out from the certification process in respect of one-off rural housing. I understand that provision applies to approximately one quarter of all housing...

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Housing, Planning and Local Government: Issues Relating to Quarries and Deleterious Materials: Discussion (6 Dec 2022)

Steven Matthews: To whom is that question directed?

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Housing, Planning and Local Government: Issues Relating to Quarries and Deleterious Materials: Discussion (6 Dec 2022)

Steven Matthews: We are into the third round now so I ask members to indicate. Deputy Ó Broin wishes to come back in. I just want to clarify a point for myself. I said people looking in want to have confidence we have a robust structure of testing and regulations in place so we do not see this again. Returning to the testing, somebody must submit their certificate of conformity to the NSAI for their...

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Housing, Planning and Local Government: Issues Relating to Quarries and Deleterious Materials: Discussion (6 Dec 2022)

Steven Matthews: Okay. Is there some kind of heading like "Test for Deleterious Materials" that sets out what materials should be looked for? Is there a stress or strength test and if it fails we say this could be caused by a deleterious material and we will therefore check for it? Is there a list of deleterious materials products that should be tested for?

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Housing, Planning and Local Government: Issues Relating to Quarries and Deleterious Materials: Discussion (6 Dec 2022)

Steven Matthews: Okay.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Housing, Planning and Local Government: Issues Relating to Quarries and Deleterious Materials: Discussion (6 Dec 2022)

Steven Matthews: All right. I lack the knowledge on this. Sulphates include the likes of pyrite and pyrrhotite. They are classified as sulphurous materials.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Housing, Planning and Local Government: Issues Relating to Quarries and Deleterious Materials: Discussion (6 Dec 2022)

Steven Matthews: And mica?

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Housing, Planning and Local Government: Issues Relating to Quarries and Deleterious Materials: Discussion (6 Dec 2022)

Steven Matthews: Is mica on the list to test for?

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Housing, Planning and Local Government: Issues Relating to Quarries and Deleterious Materials: Discussion (6 Dec 2022)

Steven Matthews: Okay. I have one last question on this. Ms Wylde wishes to come in.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Housing, Planning and Local Government: Issues Relating to Quarries and Deleterious Materials: Discussion (6 Dec 2022)

Steven Matthews: All right, and there is a certain level of sulphur or deleterious material that is kind of acceptable to have as it is naturally-occurring. Therefore, there are levels that are acceptable. When was the last time we saw concrete product either from a quarry or a producer that was tested and contained levels above the acceptable standard for sulphurous materials? I am aware NSAI only covers...

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Housing, Planning and Local Government: Issues Relating to Quarries and Deleterious Materials: Discussion (6 Dec 2022)

Steven Matthews: Do we then run into a dead end of tracing back how this ended up in here? If the manufacturer does not notify the NSAI it is not aware of it so how do we ensure we can trace it back in the supply chain?

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