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Public Accounts Committee: 2017 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General
Chapter 21 - Accounts of the National Treasury Management Agency
National Treasury Management Agency Financial Statements 2018
(4 Jul 2019)

Seán Fleming: We have no debt which carries an interest rate of over 6%. I know that there are 200 pages, but they are the figures I want to see.

Public Accounts Committee: 2017 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General
Chapter 21 - Accounts of the National Treasury Management Agency
National Treasury Management Agency Financial Statements 2018
(4 Jul 2019)

Seán Fleming: I am sure Mr. O'Kelly knows it off the top of his head.

Public Accounts Committee: 2017 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General
Chapter 21 - Accounts of the National Treasury Management Agency
National Treasury Management Agency Financial Statements 2018
(4 Jul 2019)

Seán Fleming: I want the NTMA to break down the figure of €205 billion by money amounts.

Public Accounts Committee: 2017 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General
Chapter 21 - Accounts of the National Treasury Management Agency
National Treasury Management Agency Financial Statements 2018
(4 Jul 2019)

Seán Fleming: We want the amounts of money and the matching interest rates.

Public Accounts Committee: 2017 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General
Chapter 21 - Accounts of the National Treasury Management Agency
National Treasury Management Agency Financial Statements 2018
(4 Jul 2019)

Seán Fleming: On the charts we were given it was indicated that a figure of 29% of the national debt was sourced in the United Kingdom. Was much of it moved in 2018?

Public Accounts Committee: 2017 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General
Chapter 21 - Accounts of the National Treasury Management Agency
National Treasury Management Agency Financial Statements 2018
(4 Jul 2019)

Seán Fleming: It is necessarily in sterling.

Public Accounts Committee: 2017 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General
Chapter 21 - Accounts of the National Treasury Management Agency
National Treasury Management Agency Financial Statements 2018
(4 Jul 2019)

Seán Fleming: Is it included and I am sure Mr. Black will show me the exact note. Can we have a breakdown of the sum of €205 billion by currency?

Public Accounts Committee: 2017 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General
Chapter 21 - Accounts of the National Treasury Management Agency
National Treasury Management Agency Financial Statements 2018
(4 Jul 2019)

Seán Fleming: When the accounts refer to the United Kngdom, from the NTMA's point of view, the public might assume it is in sterling.

Public Accounts Committee: 2017 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General
Chapter 21 - Accounts of the National Treasury Management Agency
National Treasury Management Agency Financial Statements 2018
(4 Jul 2019)

Seán Fleming: That amounts to about 99%. It is important to clarify the matter as people might have misunderstood. I have two other minor questions. On page 81 of the accounts there is a reference to the EU-IMF funding programme, under which we still owe €45 billion. There is a figure of €18 billion for the European Stability Fund; €25 billion for the European Financial...

Public Accounts Committee: 2017 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General
Chapter 21 - Accounts of the National Treasury Management Agency
National Treasury Management Agency Financial Statements 2018
(4 Jul 2019)

Seán Fleming: They are at a lower rate. That is fine. My last question which always interests some relates to the dormant accounts mentioned on page 136. There are charts, but and I am a little confused. I have the impression from what is included on page 140 that the NTMA holds a sum of €477 million from dormant bank accounts and €100 million from dormant unclaimed insurance policies....

Public Accounts Committee: 2017 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General
Chapter 21 - Accounts of the National Treasury Management Agency
National Treasury Management Agency Financial Statements 2018
(4 Jul 2019)

Seán Fleming: Yes, it is €103 million.

Public Accounts Committee: 2017 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General
Chapter 21 - Accounts of the National Treasury Management Agency
National Treasury Management Agency Financial Statements 2018
(4 Jul 2019)

Seán Fleming: A sum of €500 million was not claimed.

Public Accounts Committee: 2017 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General
Chapter 21 - Accounts of the National Treasury Management Agency
National Treasury Management Agency Financial Statements 2018
(4 Jul 2019)

Seán Fleming: In broad terms, €300 million has been disbursed-----

Public Accounts Committee: 2017 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General
Chapter 21 - Accounts of the National Treasury Management Agency
National Treasury Management Agency Financial Statements 2018
(4 Jul 2019)

Seán Fleming: -----out of a total of €600 million approximately. We are left with half of that sum. That leads me to page 142 on which it is indicated that €27 million went last year to different Departments. Who decides where the money is to be disbursed? Is it by ministerial direction? Who made the decision that the Department of Rural and Community Development was to receive...

Public Accounts Committee: 2017 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General
Chapter 21 - Accounts of the National Treasury Management Agency
National Treasury Management Agency Financial Statements 2018
(4 Jul 2019)

Seán Fleming: When representatives from Pobal attended and we looked at the dormant account funds in the Department, we found that it was one of the most mismanaged funds. It had been moved from one Department to another. I am not talking about NTMA's administration of the fund, but there were things that had been approved and never happened. Some of the projects were a mirage. Will the NTMA send us a...

Public Accounts Committee: 2017 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General
Chapter 21 - Accounts of the National Treasury Management Agency
National Treasury Management Agency Financial Statements 2018
(4 Jul 2019)

Seán Fleming: Is it by ministerial or departmental-----

Public Accounts Committee: 2017 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General
Chapter 21 - Accounts of the National Treasury Management Agency
National Treasury Management Agency Financial Statements 2018
(4 Jul 2019)

Seán Fleming: The Department sends a letter requesting the sum of €9.7 billion and the NTMA sends the money to it. We can take up this issue with the line Department.

Public Accounts Committee: 2017 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General
Chapter 21 - Accounts of the National Treasury Management Agency
National Treasury Management Agency Financial Statements 2018
(4 Jul 2019)

Seán Fleming: We were not happy with the amount of money claimed, money Pobal-----

Public Accounts Committee: 2017 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General
Chapter 21 - Accounts of the National Treasury Management Agency
National Treasury Management Agency Financial Statements 2018
(4 Jul 2019)

Seán Fleming: That is the only reason I have raised the issue because it has crossed our desks before.

Public Accounts Committee: 2017 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General
Chapter 21 - Accounts of the National Treasury Management Agency
National Treasury Management Agency Financial Statements 2018
(4 Jul 2019)

Seán Fleming: Okay. We are going to suspend for five minutes at this stage-----

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