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Public Accounts Committee: 2012 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 39 - Health Service Executive
Annual Report and Financial Statements 2012
Section 38 - Agencies Remuneration
(16 Jan 2014)

Simon Harris: Is he examining all expenditure relating to the chief executive? Are there credit cards in the CRC? What is this limited to?

Public Accounts Committee: 2012 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 39 - Health Service Executive
Annual Report and Financial Statements 2012
Section 38 - Agencies Remuneration
(16 Jan 2014)

Simon Harris: We can take it as a committee that as the interim administrator corresponds with the DG, we will receive the relevant information as quickly as possible.

Public Accounts Committee: 2012 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 39 - Health Service Executive
Annual Report and Financial Statements 2012
Section 38 - Agencies Remuneration
(16 Jan 2014)

Simon Harris: Have the HSE and the interim administrator taken advice on the legality or potential illegality of any of the activities uncovered to date?

Public Accounts Committee: 2012 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 39 - Health Service Executive
Annual Report and Financial Statements 2012
Section 38 - Agencies Remuneration
(16 Jan 2014)

Simon Harris: Do we know as of yet whether he has had any discussions with members of An Garda Síochána?

Public Accounts Committee: 2012 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 39 - Health Service Executive
Annual Report and Financial Statements 2012
Section 38 - Agencies Remuneration
(16 Jan 2014)

Simon Harris: I thank Mr. O'Brien. Let me try again with Mr. Conlan. When did he first become aware that Mr. Paul Kiely was retiring or intending to retire from the CRC?

Public Accounts Committee: 2012 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 39 - Health Service Executive
Annual Report and Financial Statements 2012
Section 38 - Agencies Remuneration
(16 Jan 2014)

Simon Harris: The minutes that we have are of a meeting that took place on 25 March at 5 p.m. in the boardroom of the CRC. Mr. Conlan had sent his apologies. The minutes show categorically in black and white that "he [the chairman] informed the meeting that he, Mr. Nugent and Mr. Conlan [I presume there is only one Mr. Conlan] had had a preliminary meeting with MERC, a recruitment company, to discuss the...

Public Accounts Committee: 2012 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 39 - Health Service Executive
Annual Report and Financial Statements 2012
Section 38 - Agencies Remuneration
(16 Jan 2014)

Simon Harris: Does Mr. Brian Conlan remember this meeting?

Public Accounts Committee: 2012 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 39 - Health Service Executive
Annual Report and Financial Statements 2012
Section 38 - Agencies Remuneration
(16 Jan 2014)

Simon Harris: He remembers that he went to a meeting with MERC and he accepts that it happened in advance of 25 March.

Public Accounts Committee: 2012 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 39 - Health Service Executive
Annual Report and Financial Statements 2012
Section 38 - Agencies Remuneration
(16 Jan 2014)

Simon Harris: So he accepts that he knew of Mr. Kiely's intended departure before 25 March.

Public Accounts Committee: 2012 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 39 - Health Service Executive
Annual Report and Financial Statements 2012
Section 38 - Agencies Remuneration
(16 Jan 2014)

Simon Harris: When does Mr. Brian Conlan believe he did know about Mr. Kiely's departure?

Public Accounts Committee: 2012 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 39 - Health Service Executive
Annual Report and Financial Statements 2012
Section 38 - Agencies Remuneration
(16 Jan 2014)

Simon Harris: Come on, we are talking about last year. If the meeting took place on 25 March, did Mr. Conlan meet MERC in March?

Public Accounts Committee: 2012 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 39 - Health Service Executive
Annual Report and Financial Statements 2012
Section 38 - Agencies Remuneration
(16 Jan 2014)

Simon Harris: What did he discuss? He had a preliminary meeting to discuss the available options. What were the options?

Public Accounts Committee: 2012 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 39 - Health Service Executive
Annual Report and Financial Statements 2012
Section 38 - Agencies Remuneration
(16 Jan 2014)

Simon Harris: There was no decision made at that meeting. A second meeting was scheduled with another company. Why was Mr. Conlan bumped off the attendance for that meeting? A second meeting was scheduled.

Public Accounts Committee: 2012 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 39 - Health Service Executive
Annual Report and Financial Statements 2012
Section 38 - Agencies Remuneration
(16 Jan 2014)

Simon Harris: Was Mr. Conlan out of the country?

Public Accounts Committee: 2012 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 39 - Health Service Executive
Annual Report and Financial Statements 2012
Section 38 - Agencies Remuneration
(16 Jan 2014)

Simon Harris: Okay. Was Mr. Conlan asked to serve on the recruitment sub-committee?

Public Accounts Committee: 2012 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 39 - Health Service Executive
Annual Report and Financial Statements 2012
Section 38 - Agencies Remuneration
(16 Jan 2014)

Simon Harris: Did he consent to serving on it?

Public Accounts Committee: 2012 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 39 - Health Service Executive
Annual Report and Financial Statements 2012
Section 38 - Agencies Remuneration
(16 Jan 2014)

Simon Harris: At that stage, he had no intention of-----

Public Accounts Committee: 2012 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 39 - Health Service Executive
Annual Report and Financial Statements 2012
Section 38 - Agencies Remuneration
(16 Jan 2014)

Simon Harris: Mr. Conlan said in his opening statement the this has caused him a significant amount of stress. I can imagine such media attention and difficult questions would cause anybody stress at a human level. However, can Mr. Conlan imagine the level of stress caused among the staff, whose boss Mr. Conlan was, on finding out that a board on which Mr. Conlan sat and for which he shared...

Public Accounts Committee: 2012 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 39 - Health Service Executive
Annual Report and Financial Statements 2012
Section 38 - Agencies Remuneration
(16 Jan 2014)

Simon Harris: It is fast becoming apparent, according to Mr. Brian Conlan's evidence, that a man blindfolded on a galloping horse would have been more aware of what was happening in the CRC. I am finding it really difficult. I am finding it really difficult for reasons similar to those expressed by Deputy McDonald because Mr. Conlan is not an amateur. His CV, which he referenced in his opening...

Public Accounts Committee: 2012 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 39 - Health Service Executive
Annual Report and Financial Statements 2012
Section 38 - Agencies Remuneration
(16 Jan 2014)

Simon Harris: Mr. Conlan also told us that he did not know that Mr. Kiely was leaving until 25 March.

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