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Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform: Select Sub-Committee on Public Expenditure and Reform: Valuation (Amendment) (No. 2) Bill 2012: Committee Stage (4 Mar 2015)

Simon Harris: My apologies.

Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform: Select Sub-Committee on Public Expenditure and Reform: Valuation (Amendment) (No. 2) Bill 2012: Committee Stage (4 Mar 2015)

Simon Harris: No problem.

Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform: Select Sub-Committee on Public Expenditure and Reform: Valuation (Amendment) (No. 2) Bill 2012: Committee Stage (4 Mar 2015)

Simon Harris: This amendment would duplicate what is already provided for in Schedule 3. Buildings and facilities used in connection with water and wastewater are already included in Schedule 3, specifically in paragraphs 1(a), 1(b) and 1(n). Including buildings and facilities used in connection with water and wastewater, as the amendment suggests, in Schedule 3 would be like including an amendment to...

Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform: Select Sub-Committee on Public Expenditure and Reform: Valuation (Amendment) (No. 2) Bill 2012: Committee Stage (4 Mar 2015)

Simon Harris: I know well. Let me show Deputy Fleming the difficulty from a legislative point of view. Would this mean, for example, that part of a hotel or part of a factory premises, or a large multinational with its own facilities, could end up being exempt? I am well aware that is not the Deputy's intention, but merely our interpretation of the potential consequences of the amendment. The impact...

Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform: Select Sub-Committee on Public Expenditure and Reform: Valuation (Amendment) (No. 2) Bill 2012: Committee Stage (4 Mar 2015)

Simon Harris: Yes, but it is the legal position now.

Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform: Select Sub-Committee on Public Expenditure and Reform: Valuation (Amendment) (No. 2) Bill 2012: Committee Stage (4 Mar 2015)

Simon Harris: If we include the water facilities in Schedule 3, as Deputy Sean Fleming's amendment wishes to do, it would make no difference to the ratability of Irish Water, as the exemption from rates for Irish Water is currently provided for in paragraph 21 of Schedule 4 of the Valuation Act 2001, as inserted by section 12 of the Water Services Act 2014.

Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform: Select Sub-Committee on Public Expenditure and Reform: Valuation (Amendment) (No. 2) Bill 2012: Committee Stage (4 Mar 2015)

Simon Harris: It was. I am trying to think when we went through the Seanad.

Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform: Select Sub-Committee on Public Expenditure and Reform: Valuation (Amendment) (No. 2) Bill 2012: Committee Stage (4 Mar 2015)

Simon Harris: The Deputy is correct in stating that this has only been the case since the Water Services Act 2014 was passed.

Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform: Select Sub-Committee on Public Expenditure and Reform: Valuation (Amendment) (No. 2) Bill 2012: Committee Stage (4 Mar 2015)

Simon Harris: That is correct. The reasons for making the exemption are well rehearsed and were fully debated when the Water Services Bill 2014 was making its way through the Oireachtas. For similar reasons, as I have commented on previous issues, it is a policy position that has been taken, and has been passed by both Houses of the Oireachtas under the Water Services Act 2014. Therefore, I do not...

Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform: Select Sub-Committee on Public Expenditure and Reform: Valuation (Amendment) (No. 2) Bill 2012: Committee Stage (4 Mar 2015)

Simon Harris: I apologise; I do not wish to interrupt Deputy Fleming, but he asked me a question about the €59 million. The €59 million is based on the valuation lists of certain local authorities but is mainly attributed to the four Dublin local authorities and the Waterford local authority.

Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform: Select Sub-Committee on Public Expenditure and Reform: Valuation (Amendment) (No. 2) Bill 2012: Committee Stage (4 Mar 2015)

Simon Harris: It is because that is where the bulk of the infrastructure lies, and because they were revalued.

Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform: Select Sub-Committee on Public Expenditure and Reform: Valuation (Amendment) (No. 2) Bill 2012: Committee Stage (4 Mar 2015)

Simon Harris: The €59 million is the estimate for all of the water infrastructure that has been valued in the entire country.

Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform: Select Sub-Committee on Public Expenditure and Reform: Valuation (Amendment) (No. 2) Bill 2012: Committee Stage (4 Mar 2015)

Simon Harris: It is based on all available valuations with certain local authorities. As I stated, the bulk of that available valuation is the four Dublin authorities and the Waterford local authority, but there are others in other local authority areas. I can provide the Deputy with information on these if he wishes.

Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform: Select Sub-Committee on Public Expenditure and Reform: Valuation (Amendment) (No. 2) Bill 2012: Committee Stage (4 Mar 2015)

Simon Harris: That was a matter for each local authority, but they were rateable.

Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform: Select Sub-Committee on Public Expenditure and Reform: Valuation (Amendment) (No. 2) Bill 2012: Committee Stage (4 Mar 2015)

Simon Harris: Not that I-----

Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform: Select Sub-Committee on Public Expenditure and Reform: Valuation (Amendment) (No. 2) Bill 2012: Committee Stage (4 Mar 2015)

Simon Harris: I can certainly provide Deputy Fleming with more information on where valuations appear on valuation lists, but the information I have available is that the bulk of it lies in the four Dublin local authorities and the Waterford local authority, and other available valuations.

Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform: Select Sub-Committee on Public Expenditure and Reform: Valuation (Amendment) (No. 2) Bill 2012: Committee Stage (4 Mar 2015)

Simon Harris: Following on from what Deputy Creed had to say, I have tried at all Stages of the Bill thus far to be as constructive as I can in teasing out all of these issues. In my view, we made considerable progress on this matter during Committee and Report Stages in the Seanad. However, I am happy to tease them out further today. Deputy Fleming referenced his concern for my parliamentary...

Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform: Select Sub-Committee on Public Expenditure and Reform: Valuation (Amendment) (No. 2) Bill 2012: Committee Stage (4 Mar 2015)

Simon Harris: I will be happy to do that before Report Stage. As a final point, I hear an awful lot about the competition between community-based and commercial child care. I wonder how much that is actually the case, particularly in large parts of the country. I say this more as a question and as something we might tease out. Are the community child care facilities really in competition with the...

Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform: Select Sub-Committee on Public Expenditure and Reform: Valuation (Amendment) (No. 2) Bill 2012: Committee Stage (4 Mar 2015)

Simon Harris: First, the issues of low pay and so on are much broader. I do not think there is any parent in Ireland who finds the cost of child care to be low. The issue with regard to the people providing these vital services earning low pay are broader Government issues and I am pleased the Minister for Children and Youth Affairs is looking at this at an interdepartmental level. In regard to the...

Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform: Select Sub-Committee on Public Expenditure and Reform: Valuation (Amendment) (No. 2) Bill 2012: Committee Stage (4 Mar 2015)

Simon Harris: Let us have this conversation on Report Stage. I will give the issue further consideration before then.

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