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Committee on Budgetary Oversight: Stability Programme Update: Minister for Finance (13 Apr 2017)

Michael Noonan: There was an internal contradiction between the first part of the Deputy's presentation and the second. He condemned the straitjacket of the fiscal rules in Europe which did not allow us to spend more money, particularly in capital investment, and he went on to deplore the fact that we had to pay €6 million in interest. The reason we had to pay €6 million in interest was...

Committee on Budgetary Oversight: Stability Programme Update: Minister for Finance (13 Apr 2017)

Michael Noonan: The Deputy wants us to take on more debt.

Committee on Budgetary Oversight: Stability Programme Update: Minister for Finance (13 Apr 2017)

Michael Noonan: Where would we get the money?

Committee on Budgetary Oversight: Stability Programme Update: Minister for Finance (13 Apr 2017)

Michael Noonan: We can argue theory all night.

Committee on Budgetary Oversight: Stability Programme Update: Minister for Finance (13 Apr 2017)

Michael Noonan: We do not have to rely on theory any more. We are not talking about the fiscal rules. There were five programme countries in Europe and four of them, Ireland, Cyprus, Spain Portugal, applied the fiscal rules. They are all growing rapidly and putting on a lot of extra jobs. One country, Greece, did not apply the fiscal rules and it is still mired in the difficulties it was in, having been...

Committee on Budgetary Oversight: Stability Programme Update: Minister for Finance (13 Apr 2017)

Michael Noonan: The model he deplores was applied, through the fiscal rules, in four other countries. The Irish people, in a referendum, voted for the fiscal rules. It was not unilaterally imposed on the people by a Government. I am glad we have the fiscal rules and I hope they continue, though I would like them to be refined in certain ways that would better suit the Irish experience. If we had fiscal...

Committee on Budgetary Oversight: Stability Programme Update: Minister for Finance (13 Apr 2017)

Michael Noonan: No, we are not. We are doing very well at the moment.

Committee on Budgetary Oversight: Stability Programme Update: Minister for Finance (13 Apr 2017)

Michael Noonan: There is merit in the Deputy's argument that local authorities and housing associations did not build enough social housing. In 2004 or 2005 the Minister for the Environment decided that, in allocating housing budgets, local authorities would be allowed to go into the market and buy private houses rather than construct social housing, and this certainly reduced the supply. The argument at...

Committee on Budgetary Oversight: Stability Programme Update: Minister for Finance (13 Apr 2017)

Michael Noonan: Private investors were a requirement of Brussels and included banks and various other people. The system is not structured in such a way that they share in the profit. We will check the exact figure for the Deputy. The €2.5 billion, and anything added to it in the next couple of years, will be Exchequer money. When that matures, the Minister for Finance will need to look at whether...

Committee on Budgetary Oversight: Stability Programme Update: Minister for Finance (13 Apr 2017)

Michael Noonan: While Deputy Boyd Barrett is right, it is a very diverse economy at present and is becoming more so, especially in the SME sector and the new digital economy. I saw figures recently and, although I cannot recall the exact amount, it was something like 11,000 new companies incorporated in the first three months of the year. They are in every direction. Some of them will never trade but a...

Committee on Budgetary Oversight: Stability Programme Update: Minister for Finance (13 Apr 2017)

Michael Noonan: I am in favour of the establishment of a budgetary office. Our Secretary General was notified in the last week or so by the Clerk of the Dáil that the position of director of the office would be advertised after Easter. Something must be happening if we got that notification. Once the director of the new office is put in place, it will be on its way. We will not hold it up.

Committee on Budgetary Oversight: Stability Programme Update: Minister for Finance (13 Apr 2017)

Michael Noonan: There will be a director appointed, anyway, and on it goes. There is nothing on the executive or policy sides that would prevent it from being expedited. It is one of the essential components of new politics to give independence to people like the Deputies to cost matters. I saw the Dublin Port figures. There are also figures from Dublin Airport, which say the opposite. There may have...

Committee on Budgetary Oversight: Stability Programme Update: Minister for Finance (13 Apr 2017)

Michael Noonan: Not any in Dún Laoghaire? It is a plea for the poor again, is it? The poor people on the Gold Coast. The Deputy will be looking for subsidies for them next.

Committee on Budgetary Oversight: Stability Programme Update: Minister for Finance (13 Apr 2017)

Michael Noonan: I have raised it at every opportunity I get at Eurogroup and ECOFIN meetings. We argue very strongly along with some of our smaller country colleagues that the methodology for calculating the structure of the fiscal space was flawed. It was not accurate in the estimate of where smaller, open economies were in the business cycle. There was a committee set up to redraft the rules in that...

Committee on Budgetary Oversight: Stability Programme Update: Minister for Finance (13 Apr 2017)

Michael Noonan: The kind of work we are doing now with the European Investment Bank, EIB, in my view is the best prospect of doing so and I described it earlier.

Committee on Budgetary Oversight: Stability Programme Update: Minister for Finance (13 Apr 2017)

Michael Noonan: I also described that if there was a definitive revenue flow coming from fares on a metro, it would be possible to construct something that would acceptable to EUROSTAT in terms of going off-balance sheet and we are working on that. I hope to be in Luxembourg at a meeting, chaired by the president of the EIB, specifically about Irish-related investment projects around mid-May. I hope we...

Committee on Budgetary Oversight: Stability Programme Update: Minister for Finance (13 Apr 2017)

Michael Noonan: I will talk to the agency again about it. I shall mention to the NTMA that the Deputy raised the matter. I did speak to the agency before and it is pretty happy with the policies that it has in place at present. I have a note that deals with the issue that I can read for the Deputy. It is a reply to a parliamentary question.

Committee on Budgetary Oversight: Stability Programme Update: Minister for Finance (13 Apr 2017)

Michael Noonan: I have already given the reply to the Deputy so there is no point in my reading it again. Let us consider the NTMA's plans for this year. The deficit for this year will be 0.4% of the GDP or approximately €1 billion or less. The borrowing plans for the NTMA are between €9 billion and €13 billion. The bulk of what it is borrowing is for refinancing and is to deal...

Committee on Budgetary Oversight: Stability Programme Update: Minister for Finance (13 Apr 2017)

Michael Noonan: Yes but the Deputy was a loyal member of the Labour Party at that time.

Committee on Budgetary Oversight: Stability Programme Update: Minister for Finance (13 Apr 2017)

Michael Noonan: It may not have been a personal decision. The Deputy may have been driven by the Whip. Was he?

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